Ever notice how white this forum is..

[Arrow]

We were not all drafted, uneducated, minorities that were cannon fodder. I get really upset when it is pushed that Vietnam was a war that killed blacks especially young blacks like it was something done on purpose. If you will do the numbers you will find there were exactly 7 blacks 18 years of age and younger killed in that war and yes they did serve and serve well but their losses were less totally than their percentage of the population.

just wonderin'..kinda of sad as far as I'm concerned...we need the flavor of many colors in our life to stay balanced...

[Beau]

and I wished that "Paco" would change his usser name back to PACKO --- no offence "Packo" but the name was just similar enough to an old friend's nickname I gave someone (a pure Chicano, whom attended the same OJT course just out of the Army and Bitnams) that I wrote a Packo vs Paco thing on The History Channel side. That natural linking just spoke to how absent the Brown is on the Digital Divide, but not in times of War.

One thing --- at work there are all kinds of Asians, Blacks and Women who are employed: many of them, and this is true for the Blacks, have been "groomed" for Supervisory positions, or have gone through Internships. There are no Chicanos at work --- oh, we have a couple of them with Spanish names, but they look more like they are European Spaniards than the mix of Indian and Spanish that make up our Western and S. West States --- the ones at risk; the ones that go into the Infantry, or direct Combat Support. When this state (California) names it's cities (San Franciso, Los Angeles, etc. and it Rivers and Condominium Complexes with Spanish names, it certainly must be thinking of Spain and not poor Mexico because the only Mejiconos I see are out clipping the lawns at, say "La Sol Plaza de Barcellona Heights"

I see all kinds of Blacks and Chinese Americans and Filipinos and Whites, of all genders and twists and turns --- being groomed at work--- where are the Latino Vietnam Vets at work (Civil) and where are they here ?

Robert


(I am pissed, or it's a bad monday --- sorry --- that was off the cuff but building.)

[Beau]

.

[Beau]

.

[Arrow]

Every job I have leaves me looking, for the the colors of human faces that make our world so interesting and beautiful...

I miss the wisdom of my sisters of many colors. Some of them spoke only a few words to me but they served me well over the years...

[sfc_darrel]

comes in many shades.
From the pale blonds with blue eyes or brown to the deep tanned with black hair and those big brown eyes.
We love them all and I suspect that, unless there is a picture posted here, with more than 2,500 members and many more lurkers ( Hi lurkers. Come by anytime.) that we are all the colors of the rainbow.

Beau,
When I was in college a woman that I knew (notice that I didn't say liked) got scholarships and preference in job placement for being Hispanic and poor. Her family name came directly from Spain and she was only poor on paper. Her boyfriend of many years had plenty of money but it didn't count because they weren't legal. Made me mad
:d:
Money should have gone to someone like a friend of mine who came up from Mexico at 9, worked in apple industry with the rest of the family until, in her early 30s, she worked and studied her way out. Last I know she was a Mechanical Engineer working in San Jose.
:D

[Arrow]

I wish they would post if they are out there...

my reference to many colors includes the culture (music, food, literature, perspective on life). That is what we are missing here on this forum.

One example of perspective...a black man..hears the news that Martin Luther King is shot to death...while said man is defending freedom in Vietnam...what were his thoughts..

we rarely hear..

that's what I'm talkin' about..

the code talkers of World War II have a movie made about them but it turns out that the movie is more about the white guy...

why?

that's what I'm talkin about..

I could go down the list..

maybe someone else wants to finish it..

[Beau]

.

[Packo]

The site would not accept Packo as a user name so I used Paco. I still sign off 99% of my posts with Packo.

This whole thread is a little silly to me. I look for an America where color makes no difference. I have never even thought about who's white, who's brown, or whatever the whole time I've been posting here. Who cares.

PAC"K"O

[Arrow]

Tom,

You misunderstood me. Color is important to me because I love the contrast it brings to life. We are all part of subcultures in this country that make up a whole. Note your CAV patch and the statement under it. That's what makes us interesting. I am a little shocked at your PC attitude Tom. Like it or not we are not all the same and the people of color in this country have had a whole different experience than we have had in time of war and peace. I want to hear it. And I don't think my viewpoint is silly or unimportant. I just think you don't get it. sis

[Packo]

I get it every day in the news media and elsewhere. All you hear is Black this, Hispanic that, Asian what ever, white blah blah blah. It's multiculturalism at its best. What I meant to say is that we concentrate WAY TO MUCH time in this country to a persons color. I hear it until it comes out my ears. The very people that don't want to be looked at as "minorities" etc. are the very ones saying black this, hispanic that, etc. etc. etc. They refer to themselves as "people of color". They make issues out of anything and relate it to color. If Beau wouldn't have made it more than clear that he's of Hispanic and other origins, I'd of never known, and as I said, don't care. I can't even use the user name Paco without it seeming "insensitive" cause' I''m not a certain color. All this "color" crap drives me crazy. Cause' I believe something is silly, doesn't make you such, just the thread but I stick buy what I said sis and still love ya' and have never asked your color.

Tom

[Beau]

.

[Beau]

.

[vetgirl]

"I am everyday people"

[vetgirl]

I'm getting old and my memory sometimes fails me but, I think that was Sly and the Family Stone.

[frisco-kid]

My grandfather said there's only two kinds of people: The Irish, and those who wish they were Irish :D . So... all this discussion is moot.

Yeah, I don't know why there aren't more minorities on here. Or, maybe there are and they aren't saying so. I guess we'll just have to settle for you for now, my Brown Bro, Beau. Well, we do have a Polack. It still boggles my mind that we now have THOUSANDS of registered members on this forum, and only the same handful of people that continues to post. What's up with that :r: ? Any Nam Vet knows that it was a multi-racial Armed Forces that served there.

One of my best friends at Ft. Bragg was a black dude named Murphy. When I first met him, I told him that he didn't look Irish. He said that was because he was a "Smoked Irishman", and I obviously never met one before :p . We were Buds from then on.

When I lived in Seattle, one of my co-workers was a Mexican from Phoenix. One day several of us are commenting on how we don't have any "Brothers" working with us. I told Rick he was the closest we had to a Brother. With a big grin, he says "Yeah, from the waist down" :D .

Beau, you know me personally and know all of this was said with humor, and not as a racist. I bring these stories up as a reminder that we shouldn't take ourselves so damned serious as we slog through the lives that we find ourselves living. Besides, we're all Americans first. That's our real bond and common denominator. Whatever we happen to "be" beyond that is secondary. It's fine to be proud of your ethnic roots, but never feel superior or inferior because of them. Well, except us Irish. We ARE superior :D :D :D . So, where are all these other thousands of other members? SPEAK UP!! HELLOOOooooo!!!

[SEATJERKER]

...and it don't matter a damn what color dey is...
...spoke to my buddy yesterday out in AZ. "LUCKY", and he is as he made it 25 years I think, and made SR. Master SGT, now retired pulling in all them big bucks...
...remember when I got to PCS, and he had a couple stripes to my one, and the guys would say...
..."shhhhittt, now we got a damn white yankee, from NY, and a damn black yankee from Conn, but it's good to be close to only one person that you served with, he's a little strange as he got hit in the head with a seat after it fell off a b-4 stand, and hit him on the head, but all in all, he's black as the ace of spades, and he's my friend,... now black people with 357's, I have a problem with them...
Santiago was a bronx boy who was cool, everyone buying bikes, and he wanted to ride so bad with us that he bought one with an "automatic" cause he just couldn't figure out how to shift, man did we bust his stones...
...Brothers will always be brothers, white, black ,green(you army dudes), don't mean shit what color you are, we all bleed red...

[Andy]

Arrow: I thought the intent of your original post was to say; the rumors of 30% KIA were black and 20% of the KIA were Hispanic are false. It seemed you were also saying the rest of those who served were not all drafted white boys with an IQ below 90. Did I get that right?

Beau: Sorry guy, you still look Italian to me. I know you?ve put up with lots of crap in your life which is all wrong. I recall the father of a sweet little girl forbidding his daughter to date me because of my last name (they were old English and had money). Being called Alphabet all the way through Basic and AIT was less than enjoyable. (It would have gone on but causing grief to a guy with an attitude and a 60 is a bad idea.) Living in an area where things like this matter, I?m not Catholic and not Jewish, which accounts for less than 2% of the Polish community. Did you ever consider that cops are not welcome guests at lots of parties? Prejudice takes many forms.
Do not change your name. However I could point out my favorite driver was named Beau or Bow or however you?d spell it. He lost both leg when running over an anti-tank mine and that memory still haunts me (driving down that path was my idea).

Ask Doc Fred or Packo - I really did look like a minority group member when I was working as a detective. People were always walking up to me speaking Spanish. If you look like a duck and walk like a duck, people think you are a duck.

Stay proud of your heritage and make sure Mogley is aware of where she came from but also remember aint no one on this site who was a fortunate son. Besides you sound a lot more like a surfer dude and make a lot more money than any migrant farm worker I ever met.

One last point to all, in Vietnam all the guys I met were the same color, green. We had a saying back then that still applies today. Same mud, Same blood.
Don?t mean to preach (that?s Keith?s thing). Just wanted to share an opinion.

Stay healthy,
Andy

[Arrow]

my reference to many colors includes the culture (music, food, literature, perspective on life). That is what we are missing here on this forum.

Andy et al. That's all this thread was about, I used the first quote as jumping in place it really had nothing to do with the what I was trying to say with the exception that I have no idea how accurate the stats are that are quoted there.

All the phrases in the world "same mud, same blood" will not change the fact that we are a people of many colors and cultures and because of it our history and the way we view history and our part in that history is not always the same. All I was asking is where are my black brothers and sisters, my red, brown and yellow? So shoot me. BTW have always believed that there is only one race on this planet and that is the human race. "He made of one blood all nations to dwell upon the face of the earth." But to say that within the human race there is no difference in culture and perspective is sheer ignorance. And not to invite that exchange of culture and perspective is even more ignorance. And not to enjoy the difference leaves life very dull and empty.

You all go on now and make something out of this that was not intended. I have no idea how we went from a simple question to all this defensive reactionary exchange. Maybe it is true about men being from Mars and women being from Venus. I know our bodies are a whole lot more beautiful than yours. Maybe our brains are also. (just kidding guys) (well about the brain part anyway) (I think) :a:

You all wear me out. But I love you everyone. sis

[Beau]

Originally posted by Andy


Beau: ...Besides you sound a lot more like a surfer dude and make a lot more money than any migrant farm worker I ever met. ....
Stay healthy,
Andy

I was not going to trip back, before someone started mentioning that they are 5 % Cherokee Injun --- but that hurts man, that really really hurts so bad, it makes feel so sad ... like needles and pins (sound like a surfer dude, like Jan and Dean ?) oh, Sweet Jesus.

Whats her name is right, she only posted about the lack of "diversity" here. My emphasis was on the lack of Chicanos at my work spot ---- not the Afro's, or Smoked Irish Midgets though --- or the Chinee or Flips.

"My people," in a contemporary sense, are missing and I am getting quite lonely and surrounded at work, and in my town. But then, my own mother (pure Latina from Phoenix) --- has Spanish, French, and a little Mexican/Indian in her blood, and does look more European Spanish than Mestiza.

Yes, I do make much more than Farmworkers and I wished their lot would change (better hygiene out in the fields --- Day Care and or consistent education for their children --- I never worked the fields, only stayed at "Camps"when I was a boy: very hard lives for them). There is one painting by Van Gough that speaks of the European poor (perhaps Irish), it is called "The Potatoe Eaters" --- very disturbing picture.

That hurt "sound like a Surfer Dude" ... made me cry again. But, that beats crapping ones pants --- maybe not: ever see the Homeboys, in any community, walk around with their pants low and the underwear showing for about a foot --- like my Bitnam Vet, Gyrene friend said "...they can walk and crap at the same time" to which I said "sounds good."

Surfs Up

[Andy]

Beau: Your pulling my leg, right? I told you on the phone that you sounded like a surfer dude and didn?t detect your feeling that that was an insult. You didn?t tell me I was hurting you. I apologize for being insensitive if you were insulted. I had no idea ?surfer dude? was an insult.

Being a news junkie who grew up in the 50s and 60s, when I think of minority, I think Rosa Parks who wouldn?t move to the back of the bus. Of the march/riot in Selma Alabama, citizens who were not allowed to use public rest rooms. As I?ve said there?s no doubt you?ve had to put up with more crap than necessary in your life but upper middle class and down trodden minority group member strikes me as two different, two separate things.

My soon to be daughter-in-law is black, a lovely mulatto (she has no problem with being referred to as a mulatto). She is constantly saying things like the new headquarters of the NAACP is the NBA. Great sense of humor, I love her even if she is a N.Y. Yankee fan. I once arrested a blond haired, blue eyed 17 year old who yell at me that I was a racist. He said he was Hispanic, how the hell was I supposed to know that?

Now that I know ?surfer dude? is an insult, you?ll never hear me use that term again, regarding you. If I caused you pain, as apparently I did, I am sorry. Case closed.

Stay healthy,
Andy

[Beau]

I was just puckin aroun --- just jivin Hommie --- all us Smoked Midgets jive alot. But, I guarantee you that we are not Upper Middle Class --- used Townhouse in my town is over $300,000.00 a year.

- I never claimed to be "downtrodden" or that "my people" are. I did assert that this whole "hanging on" to ethnicity seems to be a living for some Equal Employment "professionals" and I assert that there is the harm.

- I did assert that Affirmative Action seems to go to those who have rioted, in the past, the most: in the face of a very long and entrenched, Latino/Heritage in the American West.

- I did claim that until the Mexican-American border gets "closed" then we will have a steady flow of illiterate Illegals, watering down the pool of Chicanos who are educated and talented.

- I assert that even the Spanish, in the New World, gave more rights to those who were born in Spain --- lesser rights to those full Spaniards who were born in the New World, and lesser with each increase of Indian blood.

I REALLY DOUBT IF WHAT I REALLY HAVE BEEN WRITING, HAS BEEN READ.

AND, BEING A BELIEVER IN REINCARNATION, one can really get into an infinite amount of Identy possibilities (e.g. the black woman now, was a White Confederate Soldier long ago. My daughter now, was a relative in a former life. The passive looking War Protestor, was an Infantry Soldier in former lives, and so on. But, even considering this press to learn to identify how much we may be linked, in time and space, our differences is why we must collide --- here and there).

Someday, I would like to see a picture of your new, hopefully soon to be daughter in law.

JULY 25, 2002 --- I had done a great deal to support "their" Conference, those "execs." from the East Coast they flew here --- went a hundred miles an hour for the last 3 days: Corpsman (the Grunt type --- also served his second tour as a Corpman with PBRs) work friend joined me during the last day --- he, across the big room, on one camera --- me at the other, and by the A/V Switch --- the beauty came when he started signaling me, regarding camera operations --- Two fingers of one hand pointing at his eyes, meant for me to Zoom in (kinda Grunt like). DID I/we, get any credit --- like you boys say "Don't mean nothing"

Beau

[Beau]

One thing --- among the many good things about my town, is that the school that Mogly goes to is very Multi-Racial (on the brown side, that is mainly Pakistani/India/Chinese/Korean) --- and that is a nice change from when I was growing up (physically). Mogly's school won a national ranking as a "Blue Ribbon" school (Academic Excellence) --- one very good thing is that I have to pick her up at her school's Liberry (saves money, 'cause Day Care is expensive) --- inside the Liberry, I see that they have Caucasian teachers giving, mostly Latino/Latina, students somekind of special tutoring (just this little group of studeous, Spanish speaking children --- a few Asians): nice image.

You know, quite often now, Mogly will use the word "axe." I have to put her up for Adoption, or send her to my foster mother's in North Carolina for some refinement (you can tell it worked on me when I lived with them).

Beau

[judyvillecco]

Sparrow...perhaps you should join me at the smell thecoffee saloon and we can talk about some of that stuff? After all I am of a different culture but you didn't ask before.

[Arrow]

Judy no one asked Frisco and I either but everyone knows that we know there are only two kinds of people in this world those that are Irish and those that wish that they were. ;)

[Tamaroa]

I'm not quite sure where the thrust of this thread was going. I waited for a few days lurked around andam still a little confused. If the purpose of the thread was to just wonder where are the minorities, consider two things, one is that they may already be here, just not choosing to reveal themselves. Secondly, and probably more likely, minorites would not stay and post on a board that has no appeal to them.

Personally, i think ths board is tied for first place with another board I like a lot. But suppose you are a minority and sense that there are not too many of your kind on the board. Would you post topics that are interesting to minorities or would you avoid posting in case you felt your posts would be ignored or possibly vilified.

Personally, I don't care if a minority visits or not. Simply, I look at a person's HEART and CHARACTER. That is what matters. I could not care less what color their skin is or what race they are. Taking it a step further, I also get a bit annoyed with this hypenated stuff. Lets see my son is a irish-italian-french-czech-polish-german american. Or is he JUST an American? I believe that this effort to hang on to your individual ethnic or national identity causes way more harm than good. It emphasizes the differences between us creating more chaos and friction. Instead we should be concentrating on what makes us all alike.
I think we humans would all work a lot better as a team if we emphasised our similiarities not our differences -- standing by for heavy rolls!!!

Bill

[judyvillecco]

I agree...I've lost the point of this post too. Get over it and let's all be part of the human race male and female.

[Arrow]

I'm going on down town and find me some collard greens,..and some blues...I have enjoyed about as much of this as I can stand...Tamaroa..the intention of the thread is correctly assesed in your first paragraphs. You bring up many good points. And anyone that knows me knows my heart for this country. The Irish part is all done in fun and just a statement of that little rebel in me that always stands up for the little guy..Judy you are rude. Out of here...

[judyvillecco]

I am very tired of being trashed and called names by illogical people. Just because you don't agree with me is no reason to insult me. you don't do that to others and i'm tired of you doing it to me. Many people perhaps don't post because of this...did you ever think of that? If it makes you feel good to keep insulting me every time i comment then have at it. Personally There's a mighty big difference between good sound reasons and reasons that sound good. I'm trying to sound off like anyone else here and I get attacked and singled out as rude and frankly i find your behavior towards me If you like differences very strange indeed. Don't worry I will stay away from you.

[Arrow]

Judy you have been rude by making outrageous statements regard censorship of your post and your pms and ignoring the calls of the moderators to provide proof. And not recanting one untrue statement of censorship. I think we all have been pretty nice about going the extra mile with you. I am sorry you don't feel it is far enough. The crux of the matter as I see it is you are pissed about the ground rule I laid down on the Women's Patriot forum about no male bashing if you have a bitch about a man make it specific my ex, my sgt etc. But on the other hand same/same with men generally attacking women as happened on the history channel forum with a person that will remained unnamed. If you consider that censorship so be it. I thing we all have been more than a little patient with your accusations. Is it possible that you want us to admit to something that is not true? Would that make me a better person in you eyes? I am sorry I can't do that for you or any one else no matter how you want to call into question my concern for Vietnam Vets and my love of others as in your previous post on another thread.

For the record and what I see the problem to be:

First let me say Judy that there would be no Patriot files if it wasn't for Bern and David. I think I would be safe in saying that when people fund a site out their own pockets for months on end and will not allow advertising to maintain the integrity of the site that you bet they have our best interest at heart. Be nice. The Girl was jokin'.

As the song says, "She works hard for her money, so hard for you honey, so you better treat her right."

Ground rule #1 no male bashing on this forum. Speak your minds and if you have to make reference to harm done to you by a man put it in the specific and not the general. My ex, my SGT, etc. It is hurtful to me when men generalize about women so let's not return the hurt. The same goes for guys. You come on the forum and say anything like "get over it." Or demean any one of the sisters. Your post will be deleted. Count on it. Maybe some of you are "getting over it" but you had to work long and hard to get there. We are not all in the same place at the same time. Go easy on each other. sis

Main Entry: pa?tri?ot

Pronunciation: 'pA-trE-&t, -"?t, chiefly British 'pa-trE-&t

Function: noun

Etymology: Middle French patriote compatriot, from Late Latin patriota, from Greek patriOtEs, from patria lineage, from patr-, patEr father

Date: 1605: one who loves his or her country and supports its authority


__________________
LT said: "Keep Movin">>>>> Earn This



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07-14-2002 12:01 PM



judyvillecco
Mockingbird

Registered: Jun 2002
Location:
Posts: 124
Women patriots
lLook. I don't know who does what and I have explained myself enough to the people involved. What do you want more? If this site is for just a few just say so and I'll be gone. I work hard for my money too and don't see that as the issue sparrow.



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07-14-2002 02:47 PM



little sparrow
Erin go bragh

Registered: Apr 2002
Location:
Posts: 310
Now now don't be upset I was just given you a little history so you would know who does what. I understand you are havin' a hard time but we are not the enemy. sis


__________________
LT said: "Keep Movin">>>>> Earn This


Ladies night-smell the coffee
No you didn't freak me. i tried to send you a message but I wasn't able to get it through due to a message that said it was deleted and monitored. Must be my computer cause I'm told it wasn't here and what i saw I didn't. Funny I'm not diagnosed hallucinations.



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07-16-2002 07:23 PM



vetgirl
Member

Registered: May 2002
Location: new hampshire
Posts: 69
you can always e-mail me



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07-16-2002 07:42 PM



judyvillecco
Mockingbird

Registered: Jun 2002
Location:
Posts: 127
Whew...been running from Liberty mountain or something like that. Had to go offline and delete some cookies attached to my computer. Tried to secret message some buddies but couldn't. Guess my big mouth has got me into trouble again. Certain people don't like the discomfort of the topics I'm bringing up. Guess some people don't think they are patriotic enough. Seems I'm being accused of being a troublemaker. Wow I thought i was just commenting on my reality like others here.



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07-16-2002 08:04 PM



David
veni, vidi, vici

Registered: Aug 2001
Location: San Diego, CA.
Posts: 353

quote:
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Tried to secret message some buddies but the webmasters have big brother censoring me. Guess my big mouth has got me into trouble again. Certain people don't like the discomfort of the topics I'm bringing up. Guess some people don't think they are patriotic according to Falwell or some of that bunch.
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------





quote:
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
No you didn't freak me. i tried to send you a message but Ilm not allowed. This may be my last post see censorship,
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------



What are you talking about?

[judyvillecco]

You and yours have got me all wrong sparrow. i do not hate men as I think my posts have shown. I have been maried to one for close to 30 years now happily...amother Vet I might add. No you and others are too quick to judge me and put your own rules and perceptions on others. You don't know my heart nor have you bothered to get to know it. I think you got upset that I no longer hold you up as a wiser person because of your behavior. You act as if you don't like any other women to post unless they agree with you. Sorry I don't want to play your games. As far as recanting I have recanted all I care to and i have seen none of you do any recanting. Are you always right? I have opinions like anyone else. This is a forum where people are accusing all kinds of people of all kinds of things...or haven't you read other posts. What kind of nonsense are you trying to start with me now?

[Arrow]

Judy you have had your say and I have had mine. My only problem with you is your accusations of censorship. You say you have removed the post I appreciate that. Thank you. Listen you have figured out what a bad person I am but don't spread it around there are a couple of people in my life that I still have fooled.

[judyvillecco]

OK