Just an idea

[Andy]

What about a new law?
Especially during times of armed conflict if a group wants to protest they must get a permit. They must also post a bond to the city or town where the protest will take place. The bond would pay for any police or other emergency services necessary for crowd control. Arrests made during the protest would result in large fines to aid in paying for public safety.
It would be a lot like paying for a drivers license. It would be sort of a user?s fee.
?Spontaneous? protests - riots would be dealt with in the same way. Fines would go to the local public safety budgets. Individuals arrest who do not work would be made to perform public works, picking up trash etc. at a minimum wage rate.
What do you think?

Stay healthy,
Andy

[Keith_Hixson]

Yep,

Sounds right on!

Keith

[philly]

It would certainly discourage many people from protesting. It sounds good to me.

[catman]

Andy...I agree with 95% of what you said. My only gripe would be the paying of minimum wage to the public service recipients. They should be made to do it for no pay and wearing pink, like that sheriff in AZ made the inmates do.

Trav

[bbeil]

I don't like protesters for many reasons, but they are already covered by the constitution of the United States of America- freedom of assembly and freedom of speech. I am sworn to uphold the constitution and that means even if it pisses me off as a result of some protester that is clueless regarding our country and the defense of it.

[39mto39g]

People in this country have rights, Just because someone don't like what your saying doesn't mean you should have to pay to say it.
What about all the parades, gatherings in the park, school functions, baceball games, etc. etc.
Just because people assemble and voice there opinion doesn't mean there bad people, even if they disagree with you. (retorical you)
We have free elections, Thank God, and if you notice there are alot of people that vote for the other guy.
You ( retorical you again) may not agree with what they say, but you got to let them say it, or this becomes something other than America.


Ron

[Andy]

Guess I didn't make my "law" as clear as it should have been. No doubt everyone has a right to free speech, wouldn't want to curtail that. People also have a right to assemble. The assemblies I had in mind were street demonstrations. If a group gathered in a town common, in a park or some similar place they would not be causing a traffic/public safety hazard.
Recently there are been so called "die-in" where people cover themselves in red (usually red jam) and lay down in the streets. These people sit or lay down with the intent to cause traffic problems, thus causing problems for public safety, the people in these events want to be arrested. That's a far cry from a little league baseball game.
People who want to have a parade which is given approval by city government, such as a July 4th parade somehow seems different from our May Day Gay Rights Parade. July 4th is something we can or should all take pride in, it's our country. Some group wanting to tell the world they are different isn't the same.
The idea is to make any group who is on the streets, impeding traffic, without local government approval post a bond, in the event it turns ugly.
Just a thought.
Stay healthy,
Andy

[39mto39g]

I know your intent is a very good one, but it leaves to much to someones opinion of what is a disterbance if some group is causeing a traffic jam, I could name you a number of times traffic was stopped for some reason.
ie. Fill-the-boot, marithons, walk-athons, celebrations after some event, homeless persons that may wash a windshield of a car. Americans are nothing if not spontanious.
How many people would it take to be in violation of your law, 2, 20, 200. who gets to choose the number? In maugh-tee-graugh, people paint themselfs every color. I don't think ya could define what your sugesting well enough for the public.

Ron

[Jerry D]

Hey Andy you say they use red Jam to cover themselves in for their die in's :) here in Georgia we have a predator that would take care of them its the lowly Fire Ant and believe me if they tried a die in here in GA with anything sweet like jam covering them they would never want to lie down in the streets again ! :l:

[39mto39g]

How about this, Open up the traffic, If they get run over, tuff shit.

Ron

[Arrow]

:l: What Ron Said...

Those fire ants, would they be considered WMD?

What would it take to export colonies to all local police?

[39mto39g]

You don't want fire ants. Fire ants don't bite, they sting, put a drop of nasty poison that stings , and if your small and don't move, they eat you. They are really bad on any animal that lives on the ground, Rabbits, quail, phesent, don't have a chance.
Id rather have the protestors.

Ron

[Andy]

A further explanation of ?my law?.

Bbeil: Issues of free speech and assembly. No doubt everyone has the right to free speech and the right to assemble. There?s no way I?d want to infringe on free speech, more than the restrictions that are already placed on it. The right to assemble also has restrictions, I don?t think the ?law? I proposed would infringe on that right.

Ron: The law is already in place to determine how many people constitute an un-lawful assembly. I?m not sure about Texas, however several states I am familiar with have laws that say if three or more individuals gather in a public place for an un-lawful purpose (with the intent to violate a law) it is, in and of itself a violation of the law. Hence these protesters causing public safety problems can already be arrested, my issue is money and giving police a heads up on what's going to happen. Today, the protesters can go to court pay a $50.00 fine and walk away. I?d like to see illegal protesters pay for the additional costs placed on public safety. Also, if they block intersections so that a fire truck can?t get to a fire, or an ambulance can?t get to a heart attack victim they would be held liable in Civil Court.
Activities such as ?Fill the Boot? to help firefighters purchase new equipment or to aid a good cause is an assembly but there certainly is no illegal or potentially violent intent. When a high school wins the state football championship you have people driving down the road beeping their horns and yelling, a rally on the school campus and no doubt some young ladies (not your daughter of course) being over come with passion. All that is just fine, nothing really illegal. Those activities are a far cry from people assembling on a public street, burning flags, hurling threats and sometimes rock.
I?m going out on a limb here, I?d guess this sort of thing takes place a lot more often where I live than in your area of Texas. One local city?s chief of police recently said that 15% of his over time budget, so far this year, has been spent on anti-war protesters. That does not include his court over time budget which will be largely inflated when some of these people demand a trial so they can air their views in court. This is taking place at a time when the city of Springfield (for example) is laying off 76 full time cops due to budget shortages.
The intent of the law would not be to further impede a persons right to speak out but rather to make him/her more responsible for their own actions. Many of these protesters protest with the intent of being arrested. With rights there must come some responsibilities.

JerryD: One nice thing about living in this area, those fire ants that are causing you folks problems can?t live this far north. This past January in NEVER got above freezing! When the ground is covered in snow for 3 months they don't seem to fair well.

Stay healthy,
Andy
PS: Freedom isn't free, not even for protesters.

[philly]

Andy,

You're funny. "My law". ;)

[39mto39g]

Like I said, I know your heart is in the right place, Buuuuuuuuut
all that you said above is still subject to someones opinion of what someone else intent is. There was just a big fight in the court system hear over just that, some 100 kids were arested in a K-mart parking lot by Houston police because they were going to cause some problems. The city paid some big settelments and some 20 year police officers lost there jobs,
If you can tell what someones intent is, then I would very much like to take you to Reno.
In texas if you stop someones car on the street that would constitute a tarroristic act, and or attempted car jacking eather one is defendable by leathal force.
In Texas you can use deadly force if you are in fear of your life, someone elses life or protecting your property.
We don't get a lot of protestors stopping traffic. At least twice anyway.

Ron

[SuperScout]

Exceedingly workable! What all, particularly the protestors need to understand, is that there are no absolutes, even the absolute right to assemble. And with many municipalities under budget crunches, let the people who violate the "parade" permits pay for the extra protection they require. With tought fines, imposed by judges who may have to grow a pair, the budget crisis would be solved in a matter of months.

Re: the fire ants, or as they are called in some parts, "far aints", I'll be happy to export any of them to any requesting city, municipality, burg, or hamlet. But after they get to your locale, trying to get them to mind your commands is like trying to teach a chicken how to yodel. But they are very effective for getting people out of an area.

[ArtySgt]

If a protester lays down in the street to block traffic, a reasonable, trained and experienced Police Officer will know the protesters intent is to block traffic and can testify so.

[Andy]

Ron et al.
I started this thread to cause a discussion. We now seem to have a disagreement regarding the right to assemble. Your right, I can?t tell what a person?s intent is, but if it walks like an elephant and sounds like an elephant and eats like an elephant, I?d guess it?s not a mouse with a glandular condition.
If people what to disagree with the government and in doing so they want to be arrested or at least want to cause a public safety hazard they should pay to play. Doesn?t that make sense?
Insolently, prior to making this post I sent my congressman the same message. There is now a bill pending in the Massachusetts House regarding payment for protesters, protesting. I hope it passes. If there is a similar problem in other states, I hope it passes there too. If anyone wants a copy of the proposed law, let me know.
My intent was to create a discussion, an issue where we could all agree to disagree, glad we did it without anyone resorting to name calling. We done good!

Stay healthy,
Andy

[39mto39g]

Your a bugger.


Ron