custer

[MissleMonkey28]

Hello all,
Back from work and jees no comment on today. Anyways I was wondering if anyone could recomend any good books on Custer. I put it in the civil war section cause he started out there. If not any other newer reads you picked up and could recomend.
Thanks
Greg

[sn-e3]

what prospective our side or the indians?

[MissleMonkey28]

sn-e3,
Im open for any side. I am not one for the sugar coated goody goody history. Although it is nice sometimes
Greg

[sn-e3]

Go to amazon and check out the Terry johnston books about the indian wars he has alot of insite on custer from both sides and he was not well liked by either. sort of an arrigant a$$ hole

[82Rigger]

...at least in my opinion, is SON OF THE MORNING STAR by Evan S. Connell.

Lots of perspective of both sides.

[Keith_Hixson]

Custer in the Civil War worked his way up from LT to Brig. Gen. Quite feat for anyone. He graduated from West Point in 1861.
Was a general officer by June 1863. Given the honoray rank of Major General of the Volunteers at the end of the Civil War. By all accounts was an outstanding cavalry officer. He was daring, and brave. His men would have followed him anywhere.

However, his one big failure: Cocky and Arrogant. Felt he was capable of getting by with just about anything, and he did until the Sioux caught up with him.

The kind of guy you love to hate and hate to love. Very interesting study.

Books: Son of the Morning - Connell

Keith

[82Rigger]

... if you like reading that's a little more technical:

ARCHAEOLOGICAL PERSPECTIVES ON THE BATTLE OF THE LITTLE BIGHORN by Fox, Conner, et al.

It's a forensic analysis of the digs done at the site in 1984-85.

Ballistic analysis of the bullets and cartridge cases uncovers not only the numbers and types of firearms, but helps track the movement of different weapons over the battlefield.

Forensic analysis of human remains found clears up a lot of the mysteries of how the soldiers died, the contadicting number of tombstones vs. number of soldiers killed, and results in the positive identification of at least one of Custer's people.

[Keith_Hixson]

I see that my buddy rigger recommended the same book. We must have been posting at about the same time.

Keith :D

Hey we need more trivia around here!

[sn-e3]

custers brother Tom had two CMH's

[BLUEHAWK]

I have a friend, a Crow woman, who lives just north of Crow Agency, MT, and has worked with the Park Service as a ranger guide on the battlefield a long time...

It was she who recommended, SON OF THE MORNING STAR to me, and I was glad she did.

Have not yet, but very much want to read the forensic analysis too.

Years ago, her husband, Pretty Elk, invited me to have a sweat with him... about 200 yards from their home, right within ten feet of the Little Big Horn... quite an experience in several important ways... especially the part where we ran out into that cold cold river after the sweat everything dangling and flopping around and then squinching up REAL quick :D

[Tamaroa]

I agree Son of Morning Star was excellent. I also agree that he was an arrogant Jerk. There is even a rumor going around that he fathered an Indian girl. I ran across a Custer Discussion board on Delphiforums once. Had some very interesting things to say, none of them very complimentary about Custer.

BD

[MissleMonkey28]

Hello,
Thanks for the recomendations...next step finish current book and get the new ones. On Custer the problem I've been having with him throughout my life actually is everyone I come into contact with praises him. Obviously he was a dirtbag awesome cavlrymen but that that. On the flip side can anyone say wheather or not the stories of his brother being 20 times a better leader, fighter, and rider true or not. There are many i guess legends out here about them two but don't really know if they are true or not.

Example: At little big horn when the men were surrounded custer's brother basically says "F this" and ignores any thought of surrender or anything and begins to charge the indians alone unarmed.

Its things like that that make me want to get books on the two. My theory is if your interesting enough to have that many stories about you you had to be interesting to begin with.
thanks
greg

[Tamaroa]

Tom Custer holds the distinction of being awarded the MOH twice during the Civil War. The only double recipient of the medal. I'd really like to learn more about him.

Bill

PS Here is a Forum I lurked in before:

http://forums.delphiforums.com/Custer1876/start

[82Rigger]

From time to time I have wanted to post something relative to the Indian Wars, but didn't know where to put it.

Don't know if we would have enough activity to justify creating an Indian Wars forum.

David?

[BLUEHAWK]

Ayup (old timey Marine saying), I'D like to see an Indian Wars forum too :D

Know what bothers me about criticizing Custer?

That his fabled cavalry unit might be besmirched... can't let myself risk that. I know, I know, there are competent and incompetent O's in every unit... Custer just stood out quite a bit in retrospect.

Tamaroa Bill!
- What does the literature say, if anything, maybe from the correspondence of the troopers (?) about how THEY saw Custer's officership?
- As a Civil War O, WAS his leadership worthy of the fast track promotions he got, in YOUR opinion? Or, were the Yanks so desperate that they'd have elevated a man who'd commit his grounders to suicide?

[Tamaroa]

David was kind enough to set one for me last year. In fact, I posted about the Battle at the Little Big Horn there. Go to Forums: 19th Century: Other Conflicts.

As far as Generals and their worth in the Civil war, we could talk forever. However, I will not bore you to tears. There were many many young Generals on both sides. Custer did not have the only fast track to the war. Galusha Pennypacker of the 97th Pennsylvania was the youngest general in either army. Robert E. Lee's son was a General at the age of 24. There were a lot of senior colonels in their very early 20's. There is a two volume work out called Generals in Blue and Generals in Gray that give a short biographical sketch of anyone who was congressionally approved to be a General.

You can also page through Mark Boatner's Civil War Dictionary and check out the biographies of everybody he lists.

Custer was aggressive at an early age and that caught the attention of his senior officers. He also fought well at Brandy Station and of course blocked Stuart on Day three of Gettysburg.
He was good but there were a whole flock of good young officers recently graduated from West Point.



Bill

[usmcsgt65]

Another good book is "Custer and Crazy Horse". It paralells both their lives to the meeting at LBH. Most of the troops did not like Custer. He established harsh rules and harsher punishment. No drinking for the troopers, and he tied them to a wheel or hitching rail for drinking. On patrols, the troops would shot at him, 1970s version of "fragging". Troops shot Lt. Hamiltion by mistake on one patrol. Lt. Hamiltion was the grandson of Alexander Hamilton.

[Keith_Hixson]

What a bummer. The kid got shot because of the dislike of Custer. Custer doesn't taste that bad? :)

When I was working as a medic. I went on a medic call to a small furniture factory.

A nineteen year old kid had cut his index finger off in a saw. They had this big bin of saw dust. They sucked up all the saw dust up from all the machines. We had firemen combing through that stuff for hours,

His name: Alexander Hamilton.

I thought it was a joke but it was his given name. I said, Well at least he didn't get shot.

A year or so later, he was in a car wreck, can't remember the extent of his injuries but he was banged up pretty bad.

I told him: "get rid of that name, its bad luck."

Keith

[colmurph]

Keith...that book is called "Son of the Morning Star". I have a copy.