Set the record straight
 

Okay- Now that I've slept on this one , let me just set the record straight concerning the post "Bit Nam" nick names. My comment was no way directed at any individual , not even to the one that replied to the post. It is something about 3 simple little words that have ate at Me for ever! "The
Baby Killers" I don't know how other members of the Americal feel about this issue, but it is just one of those "don't go there issues with me" Don't know if I will ever get away from that. Yep! Calley didn't do us any favors as far as a reputation. When We returned wearing the "Southern Cross" from Nam the Damn protesters recognized that patch and simply labeled Us as the "baby Killers' as if We didn't already have enough to deal with. So my apology is simple. xcuse my actions if They were out of line. DMZ Lt. Luv Ya "brother" I love each of You as Brothers because that is what you are :"Brothers in Arms" I would go into battle with all of You. My 2 Sons in Iraq: Sgt Scott II, and Sgt Adrain respect each of You because where you have been and what You are: Proud Veterans!!!! Can I say anymore? take care. Coffee time!
"Old Topp" Gee PS> got my home e-mail right: gatewoodsret@aol.com

:e:

Topp ! Let's get together soon !!! Give me a call. Take care.

Larry

Topp,
I know that I can't change the past, but let me say what should have been said all those years ago...

Welcome home. We missed you and we love you very much!

DL

Hope to see you in Atlanta soon Top. I owe you a big hug. Welcome Home brother in arms, welcome home. Peace

Don`t mean NOTHIN,Top.We all know the real truth,and that`s all that matters.

Great bunch of "Guys and Gals" You are thanks! Hey dragon lady! I always get this from the guys, but actually believe it is the first time I've gotten it from a lady veteran. Thanks it meant a lot! I'm proud of all of You! Larry i'll give You a shout, ,and Lt. Should be that way in the spring. Still have to check on Danny.

Calley is not one of us.

You are. Nuff said.

Topp,

I just have to say this before I get my beauty sleep tonight. The record has always been straight with those that count.There have been somereal life experience's that the guys have posted on this site thatwill stay in my heart forever.One of them is the thread that Danny put up onhis time with you andthe brothers that were with you in Vietnam.His integrity, yours and those that werewith you came throughlike sunshine through crystal. Absolutely beautiful.My own thoughts are thatSouthern Cross patchis well represented by men of your caliber.

A big thank you and Welcome home to all of you that wore that patch and served with honor in that place called Vietnam

Peace,

Arrow>>>>>>

Hey Topp

From a young troop in Korea, Thank you for everything you gave and for paving a way for the rest of us to follow... Welcome Home Topp!

Unfortunately.............
 

the term "Baby killer" was applied to everyone in uniform after a short while. One day, I was returning to my ship from liberty (home port Staten Island). I was in uniform (Coast Guard) and was accosted by this hippie-peace-love kinda guy who was trying to impress his girl friend. The idiot screamed "baby killer" at me to my face. Wellll let me tell you, I went up to him nose to nose and let him have it. I grabbed him by the lapels of his Army fatigue coat no doubt purchased at an Army-Navy Store and ripped into him pretty much telling him how did it feel to be a coward and never ever forget that it was guys like me wearing this uniform who protected guys like him allowing them to make such outrageous statements. I know he didn't expect an outburst like what I gave him because he suddenly grew very quiet. I told him to get out of my sight then caught the ferry to Staten Island.

That was a pretty scary time to be stationed in NY. shortly thereafter, the draft office at White Hall street was bombed (1967-68) and we were all told that we couldn't go on liberty in uniform as they were afraid we would be targets by radicals. I remember thinking how sad, we couldn't even wear the uniform of our service in our own country in safety. That edict thankfully only lasted a couple of months.

Gratitude to all that served,

Bill

Thanks top. For a long time, I didn't mention my Americal service because of the "baby killer" tag the know-nothings put on us. I talked only of my battalion. I'm proud to have served under the Southern Cross now and have attended the last four Americal reunions. Quang Ngai and Quang Tin were two tough little provinces, and those of us who managed to serve there and survive know the real truth.

No Problem Topp..... I was referred to as a baby killer just 1 time and it was a painfull experience for that person. In other words that person gave up their right to a painless exit from that bar.
Topp, make sure you stop by Indy on your way to Michigan
Bob K

Bill,
My older brother was in the army stationed at Fort Dix in the mid-70s. I remember him saying that not only were they not allowed to wear their uniform off base but they also had to wear long wigs. It was for their own safety.
sad, so sad.

When I got out the Army
 

I boarding a plane for home in Boston. Wearing my Uniform so I could fly Military Standby. It was Easter Weekend. All these college students heading home for spring break. Several military guys trying to get on board (6 or 7). This one college kid called us "baby killers". I walked over to him and calmly told him, "I have never killed a baby, but I easily could turn into a college kid killer." He shut up. I guess he took me seriously because he shut up.

Keith

Bill, I didn't get quite as emotional as you! But it had the same effect. That hatred for anything military still exists in our country.

Keith,
I am sure glad your a preacher man!

you scare me. ;-)
DL

I wasn't going to do anything!
 

Just letting him know his remarks were out of line. I wasn't even angry. But, they felt that all Army guys were trained killers (I guess were where / are) but in reality most of us are / where just normal guys who happened to serve in the military. He scared himself, I guess. I'm not all that scary. Just a big teddy bear.

Keith

Us and Them
 

When we got home it was Their idea to make it, Them against US. I didn?t have a beef with most anyone but sure heard the words baby killer uttered in my direction, old high school friends would cross the street to avoid saying hello, you know the routine. Coming from one of Them it make us all angry and sad and no doubt a lot of other emotions.

John needs no big brother to take care of him but do you remember? Other units called us, the 25th the Cu Chi National Guard back when being in the National guard was looked down on by most people in Vietnam. Remember the 101st was called Bird $hit? The 4th was called IV as in intravenous. The 82nd was Almost Airborne or All Afro? Black Horse was called Scared Horse. The most nasty one I remember was the 9th. In 69 when Nixon decided to pull troops out some were saying, they decided to send home the worst division and because the ARVAN?s were already home, the Cookies (9th Division) were leaving. (No offense Gimp). We all dumped on each other, like kids, players, dumping on other high school football teams.

While in RVN I always thought it was a matter of pride on one?s own unit and a fine way of starting bar fights. Among Vets you sort of have to expect that kind of thing, it is part of our collective memory. When outsiders are around it?s best to avoid that sort of language. You know, it?s just like family. My mom might mention the time I ripped the seat of my pants out while in church if she?s talking at a family dinner but would never mention such a thing out side of the house.

Stay healthy, stay calm,
Andy

Yeah Andy,
We are like a big family. We can bicker amoungst ourselves but just let some sorry SOB try to pick on one of us and Whamo all $#@!! breaks loose.
My house is no exception. My husband calls me Wingnut and I call him Scurvy. But if anyone was to try to "diss" either the Navy or the AF we would both give them a good old fashioned whatfor.

Keith didn't really scare me. I was joking around with him. I know there is a good heart there. But that is only because I know him from these boards. I would never think to go up to anyone I don't know and start calling them names, especially something so horrific. It just proves how ignorant people can be.

Andy,

No misunderstanding on my part where John was coming from.Just saying thank you and welcome home. In recent months I have had the opportunity to say that to a few people and it always sets me back somewhat to hear them say "that is the first time anyone has said that to me"

Just an interesting aside it amazes me how those few words will bring forth a whole historyat times.I said those words to a campus police officer a few months back. Turns out he was a Marine medic serving in I Corp where his wounded werebrought by helicopter tothe deck of the USS Repose where mybrother was servingon a surgical unit. Small world.

Peace,

Arrow>>>>>

DL and Andy,

I agree with both of you. I remember throwing the inter-service insults back and forth at "dog faces", "swab jockies", and "jarheads" (and, in a few cases, it escalated to physical), but God help any civie who tried to go up against any one of them because he learned what "Close-In Air Support" meant first hand.

Trained/worked aprox. 14 mo. '68-'69 at Letterman Gen. USAH San Francisco Calif..Constant dailey hate/contempt from the local folks.Had only been married a short time before the Army decided to require my services and she and I were trying to live on the ecconomy on my E-3/E-4 pay and a job she got out there.She was a good kid and I was kinda fond of her.I saved back a little money so that I could take her out for a (sm.)night on the town on her birthday.Didn't really have any nice civeys so I wore my class A's.First 2-3 resteraunts we went to had signs in the window that said:"NO DOGS OR SERVICEMEN" or "NO DOGS NO SOLDIERS NO SAILORS".Finally found one without the sign.Waited to be seated for two and a half to three hrs. before it finally became clear that they didn't EVER intend to seat us.Had to take her home hungry and unhappy.She took it as long as she could then headed back to Tennessee,moved back in with her parents,and filed for divorce.

Sis-
Before I got hold of a computer a couple of years ago and found out that there were Vet. sites I had never heard "Welcome home" or "Thank you for your service".You can have no idea how good it is to hear for the first time-even after 30yr. or so.

NO DOGS OR SERVICEMEN" or "NO DOGS NO SOLDIERS NO SAILORS".

Unbelieveable. And to sad for words. Well Doc I'm pretty sure I've said this before but if not "Thank you for your service to this Republic and Welcome Home".

Peace onyour path now and always, :a:

Arrow>>>>>

To be fair there were those...........
 

who treated us well. During the winter of 68 we came back from a particularly nasty patrol. The Old girl was in her third decade of continuous service by then and her diesel electric propulsion was getting a little grumpy. We started out the patrol on 4 engines. By the time we got back only two were running and they tripped off line as we were mooring.

At any rate, my buddy and me were raring to get off the rust bucket after several weeks of SAR cases, ice breaking and such. We went to the USO in uniform. While there, a young lady looked at the two of us and asked us if we ever heard of "The Improvisation" Well no we hadn't but she gave us two tickets to go to this club. The donor had asked us to wear our uniforms. It was on 44th street in NYC, a new club for comics. They served dinner as well. We went there presented our tickets and immediately were treated like kings. We had a terrific meal of many courses and the owner who's name I forgot, came out and sat WITH us thanking us for our service. I will never forget it as long as I live. the comedian Rich Little was there doing impersonations. It was a riot.

I always think of that night when I hear the name Improv. I'm glad he did well.

Bill

DOC
 

I don't know what part of town you took your young bride to, but I'm sure sad to hear about your experience. I fortunately never saw this, or there probably would have been a confrontation between the proprietor, myself, and some friends. I came home several times in uniform and was never actually confronted by anybody about me being in the service. Lucky for them. I was aware of some stares and side glances, but they held their tongues.

When I first got home on leave from tour #1 in JUN/JUL67 some friends took me down to the Haight/Ashbury. This had come about while I was gone. I couldn't believe it! I returned there several times with friends while I was home, and took advantage of some of the Free Love, free booze, and free smoke. Short hair and all. I never lied about where I had just spent the last year. Had a hippie chick tell me she was kinda' turned on bein' with a "dangerous man" :D .

It changed after "The Summer Of Love." Started being more street rallies. Agitators from some of the nearby campuses would go there and stir up trouble. Heard of several confrontations between servicemen and anti-war protestors as time went on. But something that you never heard about in the news was some of the confrontations between the anti-war crowd and civilians supporting the troops. I had several friends that kicked hippie ass on several occasions.

When I came home from tour #2 the end of '68, I ETS'd and moved to Spokane, WA to settle in as a family man with my wife and new son. As the war progressed, the SF Bay Area became famous as a hot spot of anti-war sentiment. This was because of the hippie scene of the Haight/Ashbury and the huge, often violent protests held across the bay at UC Berkeley, all covered and hyped by the media. 99% of the people involved in all of this were transplants from every burg and city across the country.

So Doc, I'm truly sorry to hear about your bad experience. But I can honestly tell you that the anti-war protestors, or even the restaurant owners that you ran across, didn't represent or speak for the majority of San Franciscans. San Francisco had a long history of a military presence dating back to the Spanish California days, and was always proud of it. It's all but gone now, thanks to military budget cuts through the years. I don't know exactly how many San Franciscans served in Vietnam, but 163 of us died there.


WELCOME HOME AND THANK YOU FOR YOUR SERVICE, BRO.

TOPP
 

Like has already been stated by you and others, Calley did neither his unit nor the military as a whole any favors as far as reputation. He shouldn't even be mentioned in the same breath with honorable veterans, and anyone that calls us those "3 simple little words" and means them because of him, is just running on pure ignorance. I think Calley should have spent longer than he did in prison, and Cpt. Medina should have been his cellmate :d: .

Late summer '66, the 101st is operating around Tuy Hoa. There's a battalion of Koreans working in conjunction with us. The VC command detonate a 155 shell, killing a bunch of them. I remember hearing that their battalion commander was among the dead. I guess they cordoned off the whole place and wouldn't let anyone into the area. We heard that they killed every animal and human near the small village where the blast occurred. I never heard about any repercussions over this.