Who here really thinks Pakistan is on our side?

[GoldenDragon]

(Rather long but, please take the time to read)

Pakistan and India are on the verge of war again. Yes they have engaged in sabre rattling before but, this is getting serious. Note: This came across the wire about 20 minutes ago.

Indian Firing Continously for 24 hrs - Heavy Firing spreads Along all of LOC - Pak HC Expelled

PNS Special Updated on 2002-05-19 00:50:24



SAN FRANCISCO, (PNS) India has started limited war with Pakistan evident by the serious and dangerous developments. Starting with fiery speeches in the Indian parliament and media calling for an all out war with Pakistan. A few hours ago, Pakistan's High Commissioner in India was declared persona-non-grata without citing any reasons. In the backdrop of million man Indian Army in a state of readiness already deployed by India along all of Pakistan's border since Dec 2001.
Fighting in Kashmir has become intense. Pakistan in a news release that just came on wire at 10:45pm EST said it is arming its nuclear missiles.
The U.S. is rushing envoys to the area to try and prevent all out war.
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Just a few minutes after this came out Pakistan addressed the United States.

This is the headline of Pakistans most read (and until recently the most friendly to the U.S.) newspaper. The article goes on to say that Pakistan is being blamed for the creation of the Taliban and the failure to aggressivly enter tribal areas in pursuit of Al Qae'da. Until 2 days ago this paper was strongly pro-American and pro-Musharaaf.

"It is time to pull our troops out of the tribal areas."
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Indian War Threat:Coalition Back-Stabbing Pakistan
Updated on 2002-05-19 00:59:37


From the recent turn of events it is becoming clear that despite being the frontline state in the global war of terrorism, the Americans and the Indians are both planning a joint attack on Pakistan. On the surface it will be India but with full backing, material and logistics support of coalition forces. US are having joint army exercise in India and India just concluded its own war games. US Assistant Secretary of States for South Asia Christina Rocca was in New Delhi not for peace talks but for strategy on how and when to do launch such an attack. She visited Pakistan just to put Pakistan off guard. It is not a surprise that immediately after her visit firing by India across all of Kashmir Line of Control started. The ?green signal? to go ahead for this action and expelling of Ashraf Jehangir Qazi Pakistan?s Ambassador to India appears to have come from the Americans.
The initial groundwork for an attack on Pakistan is already complete. The analysis of vocal media shows that lately the media reports are very alarming. Claiming Pakistan failed to stop Al-Qaida or somehow helped Al-Qaida leadership and also includes various claims of Al-Qaida leadership residing in Pakistan. There is no mention of Pakistan?s total internal & external security apparatus being run along with the American security personnel nor there is any mention of full cooperation and support of Pakistan and Pakistanis in the global war on terrorism.
These media stories with the same theme of putting failure of capture of Al-Qaida on Pakistan, arguing there must be covert help from Pakistan government. This conclusion is very scary with extreme ramifications for Pakistan. Something Pakistan Government must not ignore.
India cannot attack Pakistan alone for sure. The negative tone of media against Pakistan has been a recurring theme right from the start of coalition. Despite every effort of Pakistan and the free rein it gave to coalition forces, this smearing of Pakistan in the international media never stopped, it only declined in intensity and frequency.
Once again, the world media is getting too negative against Pakistan, if you have noticed. If that didn?t worry anyone, may be watching Indian and US troops together should have made every Pakistani worried.
However, there is a bigger game going on the coincidence of various alarming events are too much. We have joint army exercise and then attack on the French people how were helping us with our defense capabilities. Now it is just too much to digest and our government is not even mentioning Indian hand. On the other hand Indians are screaming once again. Indians are claiming that Pakistan is behind a recent attack on their troops in Kashmir. This time Indians are not even blaming it on Jehadi or other forces with in Pakistan but directly on Pakistan. The international media is giving full coverage to India?s point of view.
Coalition against terrorism needs stability in the region. The implementation of this stability seems to be where regional bully given a free hand and hence squash any contention in the region. It appears despite gross human rights violations in Kashmir, India will be rewarded by making Kashmir Line of Control a permanent border.
It is clear that the coalition is expanding their War on terrorism goals to include appeasement of India. Although there are many stories that Pakistan is helping American forces to root out those armed groups within Pakistan. These groups also victimize Pakistan. Apparently none of Pakistan?s help has really registered any sincere gratitude. If it had, India would have been warned sternly to keep off Pakistan back. India would have been penalized and forced to move its force off Pakistan?s border. Not that this has not been done, India has not been condemned either. This is a clear sign of bias in favor of India.
In Pakistan, it is believed that the religious militant organizations are being backed by India in Pakistan. This achieves three major goals of India, one it raises havoc, secondly blame can be put back on Pakistan Government and third after such an incident one can claim this reflects instability in Pakistan.
Imminent attack on Pakistan by India is expected to be well coordinated with the coalition forces. Pakistan?s nuclear capability will be neutralized and will be forced hold back while India bombs vital national security installations claiming those as ?terrorist bases.?
Asking for a dialogue and talks by Pakistan has obvious not really resulted in any success, neither has participating as a frontline state in coalition generated any sincere gratitude. The media has not stopped its relentless pursuit against Pakistan either.
It is perhaps the time Pakistan makes some swift decisions on its overall strategy to safeguard its sovereignty.
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"Now, I readily admit that I am not the sharpest briar on the bush so, what do all of you think? Personally I am deeply concerned that we are on the verge of WWWIII and why is our media so silent when Pakistani, Indian and Arab news sites are jammed?

"I don't know what World War III will be fought with but, World War IV will be fought with sticks and stones."
Albert Einstein

[vetgirl]

come on all of you big strong men, uncle sam needs your help again. got him self in a terrible jam............................................... .................................................. ...............................

[Keith_Hixson]

Religious wars, Muslim vs Hindu, Muslim vs Jew, Muslim vs Christian, Muslim vs Muslim, Hindu vs Buddah, Hindu vs Hindu, Buddah vs Buddah, Christian vs Christian. Its all there in the Middle East and the Pakistan - India area.

Every man's loyality is to himself and not another. Pakistan is on our side as long as it is in their best interest. But, those people have no concept of the legal obligations to treaties, etc. Well, Pakistan is for Pakistan and when a better offer comes they'll jump to the tune of the highest bidder.

How far do we get involved. AS much as we need to thwart terrorism and nothing more.

Keith

[vetgirl]

i am invisable, you guys don't see me

[JPWatson]

Hey, vet girl i hear you, but what if India does attack Pakistan with US help??? We have our troops all over the dam place.
Our news agencies are Not saying aword. God be with our troops.


Sempers JImmy

[GoldenDragon]

Sorry, I for one have no idea what that means. Speaking just for myself I have had enough war to last me a hundred lifetimes.
You don't really think a nuclear war between Pakistan and India (or anyone else) wouldn't spread worldwide do you?
All we need is the spark. September 11 should have revealed to all American's that we are not as safe behind our borders as we think.
Yes, I think you made a frivolous response to a very serious topic but thats OK. It's allowed.

[Keith_Hixson]

After the first nuclear bomb hits. It will be the begining of WW III. Whether we are involved or not something will be aimed at us. I'm tired of war, but putting our head under a pillow and saying it won't come our way is nonsense. In both WW I and WW II America played the isolationist, that didn't work!!!! For our own good we must try to keep the peace.

Keith

[GoldenDragon]

I agree.

The article in the Pakistani newspaper had the desired affect. Their messageboards are filled with posts calling for the death of all Americans. We had a Special Forces trooper killed this morning. Those people exist on conspiracy theories.
The worst part is they act on them, waiting for evidence or proof is not in their nature.
I pay a lot more attention to the mindset of people overseas than I do to the watered down U.S. media.

Hell I didn't even really realize we were at war with Vietnam until I got orders to go there in 1965. LOL.

[Seascamp]

At any given time there are 1.5 million students attending 15,000 Madrassah seminaries in Pakistan. This is the core feedstock that fuels the Islamic hate machine that is slowly dragging this world into the depths of religious war, one more time. And yes, the Madrassah in Pakistan is the birthplace of the Taliban and to pretend otherwise is living a lie. For all intents and purposes Pakistan has shown no willingness to clean this mess up and tends to minimize the threat to the rest of the world. I?m sure the John Walker path from Pakistan?s Madrassah Seminary to Al Qaeda terrorist camp to some sort of stupid Talib terrorist is a well-worn path. So is India going to have a very belligerent stance toward Pakistan? You bet! India is on the top of the list for the Islamic hate butcher shop right along with the USA. Allegedly only 5% of Pakistan subscribes to the hate filled fundamentalist Islamic dogma and I believe that is so. But the real issue is the 95% that can?t or won?t control the lunatic fringe 5% and there in is the rub and danger.

As Keith stated, Pakistan will do what is best for Pakistan and that usually is not in the best interest of the US. The reverse is true as well. It is in our best interest to stay close to India and yet keep functional ties with Pakistan. Obviously, that can?t go on indefinitely given the current fundamentalist driving force to eradicate ?infidels? from the face of the earth. If and when push comes to shove I know who we will side with, no doubt in my mind at all. Maybe that is part of the system of checks and balances that keeps things halfway glued together these days. If the Pakistani?s don?t like it then they always have the option to clean up their Madrassah hate mess and become part of the solution as opposed to being the core of the problem.

Fair seas, Bill

[Keith_Hixson]

Couldn't have been better stated!!!!!!
Very well said and laid out in a logical pattern.

Keith