Dubya vs Barry and our Marines

[Arrow]

Mr. Riley wrote:

“At first glance, this might look like the ultimate photo-op; the Commander-In-Chief serving American soldiers in Baghdad with a perfectly cooked Thanksgiving turkey in 2003 after the invasion of Iraq. Only that’s exactly what it was– a photo-op. It later turned out that the perfectly-cooked turkey Bush served was actually made out of plastic and merely decoration.”
　
Mr. Riley,

My post was made to challenge your facts on President Bush‘s visit to the troops on Thanksgiving of 2003. The Washington Post article posted in the Seattle Times proved you wrong about the plastic turkey. The eye witness account sent to Black Five proved you had your facts wrong about the Thanksgiving Dinner being just another photo op for President Bush.

You did not address those facts in your rebuttal but instead attacked Matthew (Black Five) Burden. You not only attacked Matthew Burden but you got your facts wrong in the process.

You stated:

““Blackfive tells a real heart-warming story of the event and he seemed choked-up just being in dubya's presence. I never put it past the Bush admin to hand-pick journalists allowed to cover events. Based on this story, Burden seemed deeply in love with Mr. Bush ("I felt like I was drunk")”

Mr. Riley,

A review of my first post will tell you Matthew Burden was not the eye witness at the Thanksgiving Dinner. The eye witness was the active duty Captain that sent the e-mail to Matthew (Black Five) Burden @ blackfive.net.

Do your caustic assumptions in regard to Matthew Burden now apply to the active duty Captain that sent the e-mail?

I don’t know the Captain or Matthew (Black Five) Burden personally but I can say without hesitation having done some research on my own regarding Matthew (Black Five) Burden he is an exemplary Warrior that served this country for over twenty years and continues to serve in an exemplary way as an advocate for both active duty and wounded Warriors and their families.

He has also advised both the Bush and Obama administration on critical military and veteran's issues.

He founded in 2009 Warrior Legacy Foundation and serves on the Board of Trustees of Soldiers Angels. I have no doubt the Captain that wrote the e-mail has the same stellar career. I accept the Captain's description of the Thanksgiving Dinner. I regret you find it necessary to question the motives of a man that had no idea his e-mail would be sent around the world only to be scrutinized with such cynicism.

It’s an old tactic refined by the radical Saul Alinsky, ignore the message and attack the messenger, i.e. Matthew Burden and/or the active duty Captain that sent the email.

"Pick the target, freeze it, personalize it and polarize it."


Nothing new to be seen here, moving on now,

Arrow

[catman]

jriley1349...just who are you and where do you come from? You are addressing a bonifide war hero and COL of the US Army. Show some respect or hit the road. I have no time for your bullshit.


Trav

[SuperScout]

Here's how I'll address you: good bye.

[BLUEHAWK]

Also, it is just wrong to declare that he did not deserve to wear a flight suit, aboard that vessel or at any other time or place.

His military record is clear, and clean. The man legitimately flew combat aircraft, currently then being deployed to theater Vietnam.

Here is a link see to his service:

http://airforce.togetherweserved.com/profile/102516

[jriley1349]

Apparently, a bunch of credible newspapers pumped the plastic-bird story because of the Washington Post title by Mike Allen (who was on the trip with Bush) "Bird Was Perfect, But Not for Dinner":

Wash-Post:
http://www.washingtonpost.com/ac2/wp...33090-2003Dec3

At least a few other major papers ran with it:
Guardian:
http://www.guardian.co.uk/world/2003/dec/06/usa.comment

SeattleTimes:
http://seattletimes.nwsource.com/htm...hturkey04.html

Later, the Washington Post issued a clarification - as I am now doing. Must have been my liberal, anti-Bush bias clouding my judgement and research. The point was about Dubya using the military as props for PR - plastic turkey or real "adornment prepped by a contractor", my claim remains that our troops were used as PR props for getting that all important photo... for those of you who got all in a twist about plastic or real. There's plenty of other military prop examples but I sense that most of you are not interested.

As for my anti-Dubya bias, he is:

...the same president who warned Americans of a potential Saddam-sent mushroom cloud over the United States – at a time when U.S. intelligence said Saddam had no nuclear weapons and his airspace was controlled by the U.S. Air Force and he had no long range bombers; the same president who linked Saddam and Al Qada – when in fact they were closer to enemies; and the same president who proclaimed “The United States does not torture” when the world has seen photographs of U.S. soldiers engaged in prisoner abuse and while his Vice President was lobbying Congress to make sure the CIA was not prevented from using torture.
--Kevin Zeese

Anyone got a problem with those claims? I'm sure some of you will.

I tend to be biased about a president who diverts a war of necessity waged against those who actually attacked us (Afghanistan/Taliban/Qada/Bin Laden) for a war of choice (Iraq) for which the invasion exhibited more "shock and awe" than planning. For those of you who might put anti-military words in my mouth....that claim takes nothing away from the troops who are tasked with executing those orders and continue to do so professionally and honorably. Hell... in 2003, I probably would have been cheering Dubya in that mess hall as well - believing what we were told then. But with the passing of years and hindsight, one starts to thread together facts and events until one understands that the justification, may not have been as it was sold. Like so many Vietnam-era vets, I get resentful about how our political leaders wasted the youth, ideals and lives of our generation. I'm hopeful that today's troops will be spared that legacy in coming years. And if they get the respect they deserve, it is at least in part, because Vietnam veterans forced their own ugly homecoming experience into the American public's face.

Yeah, I'm surely a cynic when it comes to politicians that betray American trust when it comes to war. "Barry" after a year seems to be putting the priorities (from my perspective) back where they belong with the Afghan surge, more drone strikes, capture of Taliban leader and (you guys will really hate this) Hillary Clinton doing the hard work of diplomacy to get cooperation with Pakistan's intelligence to make that possible. Although, I doubt if anyone on this forum would agree.

Arguing about whether a turkey was plastic or not? That's the bullshit least of it...but have it your way.

[Arrow]

JRILEY1349 wrote:

"Like so many Vietnam-era vets, I get resentful about how our political leaders wasted the youth, ideals and lives of our generation. I'm hopeful that today's troops will be spared that legacy in coming years."

Mr. Riley,

I read your profile and you state that you guessed you got lucky because you didn’t have to go to Vietnam. Then you go on to speak of wasted youth, ideals and lives of your generation and how resentful you are.

Cuss, whine and moan.

Will somebody in this crowd step up and cry me a freakin’ river!

Let me tell you something Mister the love of my life most certainly did not waste his youth, his ideals or the short life that he had. He did not regret for one minute his service in Vietnam. He was a MAN before he went to Vietnam. He was a MAN when he came home. He was MAN in his dying. And he was the best thing that ever happened to me. Everything he went through and the courage he displayed going through it gave me the tools to survive and raise his children to mature hard working adults

Furthermore, the only resentment I have is towards whining bitter Vietnam Veterans that at this writing have been given some forty years longer than he had to get it right.

Arrow
　
And by the by, your long political spiel on this forum is in direct conflict with your request that all political commentary should be constrained to the political forum.

[SuperScout]

.... for telling this whiner how reality works.