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Old 04-04-2003, 03:34 PM
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colmurph colmurph is offline
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Default Is that Civil Service or Civil Serve-Us?

Lately, my dealings with the INS and other civilian agencies, leads me to believe that none of them see themselves as "Public Servants" but more as "Public Administrators/Satraps."
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Old 04-04-2003, 04:53 PM
judyvillecco judyvillecco is offline
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amen! I AGREE! LIKE DON'T BOTHER ME I'M ON A COFFEE BREAK IS HOW THEY BEHAVE. I KNOW WHAT YOU MEAN! I TALKED TO A MAN WHO WAS WITH CONSUMER AFFAIRS WITH THE VA HOSPITAL AND ASKED HIM A QUESTION AND HE WAS SO RUDE LIKE " DON'T BOTHER ME." WHEN I TALKED WITH A LOCAL PERSON I WAS TOLD HE TALKED TO EVERYONE THAT WAY AND WAS A JERK. WHEN I ASKED WHY HE WAS IN CUSTOMER RELATIONS I WAS TOLD HE HAD BEEN THERE TOO LONG TO AND THEY COULDN'T FIRE HIM! :cd:
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Old 04-12-2003, 12:35 PM
Andy Andy is offline
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Civil Service came into being to replace the Spoil System. Back in the 1880 and before whenever someone new got elected an entire agency might be replaced by the folks who got the new politician elected. It was very bad if you?d backed the wrong candidate and sure caused a lot of chaos. Civil Service was a great idea 120 years ago but times have changed.
Today a person gets a Civil Service job based in large part on the government being politically correct. A friend of mine got a 99 on a civil service test to become an Environmental Police Officer (trout police as we call them). A woman in Boston, who may have never been in the woods, got a 70 on the same test and was hired.
Testing should be color and gender blind. Psychological testing should be done for all government jobs, not just local and State police. Further, there should be an every 3 year review on the employee. If he or she isn?t doing their job, they should be shown the door.
I guess I?m not totally anti-Civil Service but drastic changes need to be made. Most Civil Servants that I know are unionized which affords them all the protection they require. Civil Service testing should be done by giving each applicant a number, not a name and all the other personal information which is now done. If two people obtain the same score then I can see giving the job to a minority or woman but this 99 Vs. 70 and giving the job to the person with the 70 isn?t a good idea.
People who act like an a$$ are everywhere, in every job. That's why a like the idea of psych testing AND a long probationary period.
If you were to totally abolish Civil Service, it would be replaced with what?

Stay healthy,
Andy
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Old 05-09-2003, 07:43 PM
judyvillecco judyvillecco is offline
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Andy.
Corporate greed? Your probably right maybe socialized stuff isn't so bad. I definitely think socialized medicine is the answer. I really like your psychological testing idea for government service! How about for all our representatives too! I like it! I agree about scoring too. Should be fair and square.
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Old 05-09-2003, 08:19 PM
bbeil bbeil is offline
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Do not be pushed around by any civil service employees! They are running a bluff if they tell you there is no one to talk to about their actions and performance of their job. All civil service administrators answer to elected officials at every level-city,county,state and federal. The appointed administrators do not want to take any heat generated by some civil service employee under them and if you contact the elected official you will see that $hit does run down hill.
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Old 05-09-2003, 11:25 PM
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Keith_Hixson Keith_Hixson is offline
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Post It is an easy thing to do!

Sometimes the best workers in Civil Service Jobs take real ownship of their jobs and forget they are public servants. Others just become lazy and don't want to work. At any rate the public gets short changed.

Keith
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Old 05-10-2003, 12:11 PM
judyvillecco judyvillecco is offline
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Keith, yes some do.
Bbeil I know what you mean but sometimes they even defy the elected official if it's not the party in power as has happened to me recently in trying to get paid for a two year bill VA owes me for seeing a patient of theirs with a valid treatment plan. They decided not to pay and Senator Nelson has tried to get JIm Nealey in Biloxi to pay but he won't acknowledge or answer for two years now and keeps saying they are working on it.

Champus did the same thing to me for three years on multiple patients and I had to go bankrupt. What I learned from that was the government doesn't honor their bills to small business people and being one person in business it has put me out of business and my patients on the street.

This triggered old PTSD issues for me and the VA in St. Pete has had me in limbo 2 years. They kill with silence and beurocracy and inepttitude. This is how they serve and render you helpless and hopeless and hope you die and go away.

That's why I think raises for those civil service employees especially in Washington. (They take care of themselves first) is worthy of a revolution because they are rendering people like me who have worked since I was 15 (younger actually) homeless, penniless,ill and hopeless.
I served my country during the Vietnam era and I get up yours. Same with Social Security because I can communicate and have a Masters Degree even though I'm broken down. In Bush country I know a Man who was in intensive care and they said he was able to work.
Oh I'm willing but who wants a crippled, PTSD 55 year old who has to go to therapy 3 times a week and walks on crutches with so many meds she can't get insurance?My doctors have a list of medical conditions a page long. Sure I can talk and half way think and I'm smart. So what? That and a nickel won't buy me cake Bush.
Well enough of my soap box
Peace to all!
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Old 05-10-2003, 04:49 PM
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MORTARDUDE MORTARDUDE is offline
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Default two sides to this issue...

as a federal civil servant since 1972 I feel there are issues to discuss from the side of the public, whose tax dollars pay our salaries, to the Congress who fund..or I should say..many times fail to fund...the programs that the public needs, or was promised...to the civil servants themselves who, more often than not, deliver good service. Will post more as I have time. The VA is a case of advertising for and getting patients and then having the Congress not giving the VA the funding needed to take care of them..The American Legion had several articles about all of this in last month's magazine and online...But it happens thru out the federal government.......the public clamors for programs and service...Congress taxes and spends to provide...government employees must contend with inadequate funding, a hostile public when service is not provided, and politicians who just provide more BS...

Larry
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Old 05-11-2003, 03:25 PM
judyvillecco judyvillecco is offline
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Larry,

You are absolutely right. Some of the good civil servants are caught in the middle as are those of us who don't want to be. My VA counselor got so upset last week discussing my situation I suddenly felt I was counseling her. I felt better after seeing her frustration just knowing it wasn't everyone. It's like they tell them to do a job with both hands tied behind their back. I can see their frustration too. We are all caught in the beauracracy but those politicians get paid above all else and get raises and see to it they have their checks and benefits. You can bet on that. Still I think the bad civil servants need to quit or be fired if they can't take the heat. They have benefits those of us coming in don't(At least in my case) I am not nasty as I've seen others and try to treat them as I want to be treated but it seems if you do that they treat you like dirt. What's the gig? The squeaky wheel does get the grease. Being nice gets you abused. Anyway they can give me one of their civil service jobs and I'll be grateful to get it if it's so bad. It can't be as bad as trying to run a business not getting paid by your governmen t. Try not paying one of those civil servants 3 years and see how long they stay.
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Old 05-11-2003, 06:55 PM
theoddz theoddz is offline
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Default Civil Service workers

Let me speak as a disabled vet AND a "civil servant". You see, I work for the VA.....and am a health care provider (not a nurse). I think I can sum it up in another way for you so you can get the true picture....

"We the unwitting, led by the unknowing, can now do virtually anything with nothing."

I work for the VA because it is WHERE I WANT TO BE. I do it NOT because I cannot work somewhere else or because I make "so much money" from the VA. Did you all know that the average civil service worker makes approximately 30% less than our private sector counterparts?? What I do, for a large part, is a LABOR OF LOVE. I am here because I am a VETERAN..... and a SERVICE-CONNECTED DISABLED one, too. I am here to HELP my fellow vets because I understand what it was to have "stood the watch". Oh, and I'd be willing to bet that, if you withheld pay from a worker in any industry in the private sector, they would do exactly what a civil service worker or any other worker, for that matter, would do.....walk off. Why are you attempting to set a double standard for anyone who works for a living??

You all, who are so quick to complain, need to understand that the VA system serves many hundreds of thousands of veteran patients nationwide who are, typically, chronically ill, elderly males who are at the low end of the socio-economic scale. Most have no insurance and the VA gets no reimbursement for the care of these men and women who, many times, pay absolutely nothing for treatment of their complex, difficult to treat and expensive illnesses. In these days of increasing numbers of uninsured people, the VA is getting flooded with new patients, although funding has not increased to care for them. The VA is like a lifeboat in a sea of drowning people and *NEWSFLASH*: THE BOAT IS GETTING SWAMPED!!!

If you want to get angry and complain about something, get mad at the POLITICIANS. Get mad at the PRESIDENTIAL ADMINISTRATION who has, apparently, forgotten about those of us who served and whom this nation owes a debt to. He's been too busy funding a war and creating even more sick and disabled veterans to worry about the ones he already has.

If you want to get mad, bitch and complain, be sure you are addressing the correct respondent. I'm just as mad as you are, but I'm in the middle here. I have to battle attitudes such as yours that are aimed at me and also find also find ways to deliver quality care within the scope of very limited resources. Quite frankly, I think I have a right to get a little defensive.

Peace.
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