Is the South still fighting the Civil War, or...........

[Tamaroa]

Are just not sympathetic to their point of view!!!I read the article about pacification with much interest, because the first thing that came to mind was the similarity to how Southerners must have felt after the American Civil War and to some extent how their descendants feel today.
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"In the article he talks about how U.S. Forces would patrol the Mekong Delta at night and, from boats, set fire to shoreline villages, using bows and arrows. The next day civil action teams of soldiers and civilians would arrive with sheets of corrugated tin for new roofs, bags of rice and bars of soap and sweaters from stateside church groups. He said it was all part of the "pacification" process. What disturbed him the most was the look in the eyes of the affected villagers, "The children would be terrified, but also oddly fascinated in that way kids have."
"The mothers, beyond ordinary fear, would be wildly angry, often unleashing a flood of invective that, of course, none of the Americans could specifically understand because no one spoke the language."
"The old widows...would look at you with the cold, dead eyes of people who had been violated forever and seemed to expect always to suffer."
He goes on to say how the men would be the most angry and vocal and would sometimes be beaten down by interpreters and would look at you with, "...the clean, white fury of men who have been reduced to abject humiliation and powerlessness in front of their families."
He then compares it to today's actions in Iraq, specifically one in which several soldiers broke down the door of a house... "The eyes of the U.S. soldiers...filled with confusion and shame at what they were being made to do by their government."
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Read a piece of the introduction reprinted here and think again. This time in terms of a defeated, subjugated South ruled by the Federal Army and the Freedman's Bureau. I think some striking parallels can be made. Are Southerners still fighting the Civil War as some unsympathetic people feel or are they simply remembering what their grandparents told them. I will admit to being an ardent admirer to the southern soldier as well as their assertion that if they entered the Union voluntarily, they should be able to leave voluntarily. So I am somewhat prejudiced in their favor.

I also had the good fortune and privilege to live among southerners for 7 or 8 years. I learned a lot. I was exposed to a lot, including the balderdash that they are still fighting the Civil War. They are not fighting it. They are just remembering it! A couple of years ago, an old acquaintance of mine passed away. His name was William Cary Breckinridge. He was a southern gentlemen, intensely proud of his Civil War heritage. His FATHER had fought in the War of the Rebellion as a member of the Fincastle rifles, Company D. 11th Regiment of Virginia Volunteers.

Back in 1974, I had the honor to interview Mr. Breckenridge about his ancestor because I was writing my college thesis about the Fincastle Rifles. The interview was priceless. As Mr. Breckinridge talked about his father, his eyes lit up with a fierce pride. His father did survive the war. His pistol and sword still in the possession of the family.

Tony Horowitz wrote a great book called Confederates in the Attic. He explains the phenomenon by stating that in the south, 6 out of 10 people had ancestors in the Confederate Army. In the north 2 out of 10 had ancestors in the Union army with the ratio shrinking to 2 out of 100 in New York City. Consequently, the war is still very close to southerners. It is a vital part of their family history. The feelings left behind by Reconstruction are still there because they are still close to the event. What other section of the country has endured what the south has? I wouldn't forget either.

I don't know if the author was southern or not, but if he was, I'll bet that a ghost of his ancestor guided his thoughts.

Bill

[BLUEHAWK]

Bill -
I believe that, as you say, the south is not still fighting the Civil War, but is remembering it.

I believe that ALL groups who have lost wars on their own soil also never forget, in any part of the world, and at all times in history. War and conquest cannot help but create generations of those who never forget... some of whom can be expected to take up arms against the victor again, sooner or later. To wit, the conquest of Jerusalem by the Crusaders.

I believe that no attempt at reconstruction ever fully succeeds to restore wholeness to a conquered ("liberated"?) people.

I believe that the history of conquest is written, and forever promulgated, for the benefit of the victors and ignoring the conquered.

I believe that what is a just cause for the victor or the aggressor is always a crime to the other side, and vice versa.

I believe that war has never resolved that which caused it.

I believe that in the absence of direct democracy in America there will come a day when another kind of terrible conflict will arrive here, because the issues at root in 1860-65 have rarely been addressed since.

[MORTARDUDE]

Bill :

Yes the book by Tony Horowitz "Confederates in the Attic" was super. It does explain a lot. When you look at what was done to the South from 1861 - 1885, how could we not remember it ? We fought to defend our homes, property and families. The "slave reparations" scam and the continuing controversy over "the Stars and Bars" sticks in my craw. How many slaves were brought from Africa under the Rebel Flag ? How many under the "Stars and Stripes" ? The leaders of the black community in this country do not want to accept responsibility for anything. Unfortunately, the descendants of the Confederate nation have been forced to, and haved moved on.

Larry

[Jerry D]

Bill: It was great reading your topic, Thanks . Today in the south we aren't fighting the civil war we are just trying to keep our heritage alive. When something happens to affect the Muslims, Hispanics, Jewish, Irish, GLBT groups it's labled a hate crime. But, if you vandalize a confederate monument or graveyard it might be considerd free speach an probably won't even get on the local news If a church is burned down or vandalized it's ignored by the press unless its a historic black church then its a hate crime ,then and only then. So, in this new land of diversity the only thing that seems to be fair game to try and destroy is anything confederate related. Also Today on a college campus you are restricted from hanging a Battle Flag from your dorm room window but someone else could hang an ANC, Red Army Faction, Hammer and Sickle, or red Chinese or NVA flag and no one would complain. BTW most all states in the south east are still under the Reconstruction laws imposed after the Civil War i.e. voting observers, and whenever a voting district is redrawn it can't be done with out federal approval.

[Jerry D]

Reprinted from http://hammer.prohosting.com/~cward/...sassIndex.html
; Did you see the article in the online version of the Atlanta Journal-Constitution a few weeks ago about the Wisconsin feller living in Atlanta who wants to start a chapter of the Sons of Union Veterans of the Civil War? Who says he has a message for Southerners -- that the yankees were the "good guys"? And who has set out to rehabilitate the image of william t. sherman? In the very path of his looting, burning, murdering "March to the Sea!" Well, the "guy," as they say up north, made the mistake of puttin' his email address in the article. I guess you've figured out by now I had to backsass him. Here's my L-O-N-G missive to him -- and his short but not sweet reply.
--cw
SOUTHERNERS ARE "STILL ANGRY" BECAUSE THEY "GOT THEIR BUTTS KICKED?"

IN THE WORDS OF UNION GENERAL DON CARLOS BUELL (WHO WAS ACTUALLY A NORTHERN GENTLEMAN AND A DECENT HUMAN BEING, UNLIKE SOME OF THE OTHER "GOOD GUY" YANKEE BARBARIANS -- SHERMAN, SHERIDAN, BUTLER, TURCHIN, ETC.)

"It required a naval fleet and 15,000 troops to advance against a weak fort, manned by less than 100 men, at Fort Henry;
--35,000, with naval cooperation, to overcome 12,000 at Donelson;
--60,000 to secure a victory over 40,000 at Pittsburg Landing (Shiloh);
--120,000 to enforce the retreat of 65,000 intrenched, after a month's fighting and maneuvering at Corinth;
--100,000 repelled by 80,000 in the first Peninsular campaign against Richmond;
--70,000, with a powerful naval force, to inspire the campaign which lasted nine months, against 40,000 at Vicksburg;
--90,000 to barely withstand the assault of 70,000 at Gettysburg;
--115,000 sustaining a frightful repulse from 60,000 at Fredericksburg:
--100,000 attacked and defeated by 50,000 at Chancellorsville;
--85,000 held in check two days by 40,000 at Antietam;
--43,000 retaining the field uncertainly against 38,000 at Stone River (Murfreesboro);
--70,000 defeated at Chickamauga, and beleaguered by 70,000 at Chattanooga;
--80,000 merely to break the investing line of 45,000 at Chattanooga, and 100,000 to press back 50,000 increased at last to 70,000 from Chattanooga to Atlanta, a distance of 120 miles, and then let go an operation which is commemorated at festive reunions by the standing toast of "One hundred days under fire;"
--50,000 to defeat the investing line of 30,000 at Nashville;
--and, finally, 120,000 to overcome 60,000 with exhaustion after a struggle of a year in Virginia.
--From the third volume of "Battles and Leaders of the Civil War"

OR, AS DR. CLYDE WILSON, PROFESSOR OF HISTORY AT THE UNIVERSITY OF SOUTH CAROLINA, HAS SO SUCCINCTLY PUT IT:

"It took twenty-two million northerners, aided by the entire plutocracy and proletariat of the world, four years of the bloodiest warfare in American history and the most unparalleled terrorism against civilians, to subdue five million Southerners -- all followed by the horror of Reconstruction." (-- from "Dispelling Southern Myths")

PETERSON, YOUR HERO, sherman (ptui!) WAS AMERICA'S ORIGINAL WAR CRIMINAL, COMMITING CRIMES AGAINST HUMANITY ("...KILL A FEW [CIVILIANS] AT RANDOM...") AS HIS OWN ORDERS DEMONSTRATE:

...found in "War of Rebellion, Official Records of the Union and Confederate Armies." In Series I, Volume XXXIX, Part III, page 494:

Headquarters, Military Div. of the Miss, Rome Ga. Oct. 29th, 1864 Brigadier General Watkins, Calhoun, Ga.:

Can you not send over to Fairmount and Adairsville, burn ten or twelve houses of known Secessionists, kill a few at random, and let them know that it will be repeated every time a train is fired upon from Resaca to Kingston.

W. T. Sherman Major General Commanding

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...in Series I, Volume XXXVIII, Part IV, Page 579, another evidence of the general's heartlessness, as follows:

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Headquarters, Division of the Miss. In the field, Big Shanty, June 23rd 1864 Major T. B. Steadman , Commander of District of the Etowah, Chattanooga

General ..............................Now if torpedoes are found in the possession of an enemy to our rear, you may cause them to be put to ground and tested by a wagon load of prisoners, or if need be citizens implicated in their use. In like manner if a torpedo is suspected on any part of the road, order the point to be tested by a car load of prisoners or citizens implicated, drawn by a long rope. Of course an enemy cannot complain of his own traps. I am etc.,

W. T. Sherman Major General Com.

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Brigadier General John M. Corse, Rome, Ga. In the execution of sealed orders No. 115 you will destroy tonight all public property not needed by your command, all foundries, mills, workshops, warehouses, railroad depots, all other storehouses convenient to the railroad, together with the wagon shops, tanneries, or other factories useful to our enemy. Destroy the bridges completely, and then move tomorrow to Kingston or beyond.

W. T. Sherman Major General.
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AND IF YOU THINK THIS IS THE BEHAVIOR OF "GOOD GUYS" -- I'M AWFULLY THANKFUL I DON'T LIVE NEXT DOOR TO YOU!

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From "The Sack and Destruction of Columbia, S.C." by William Gilmore Simms:

"Day by day brought to the people of Columbia tidings of atrocities committed... long trains of fugitives seeking refuge from the pursuers. ... village after village -- one sending up its signal flames to the other, presaging for it the same fate ... where mules and horses were not choice, they were shot down ... young colts, however fine the stock, had their throats cut ... the roads were covered with butchered cattle, hogs, mules and the costliest furniture ... horses were ridden into houses. People were forced from their beds, to permit the search after hidden treasure."

Union troops entered Columbia in an orderly manner with Sherman and his officers firmly in control. But shortly after the officers withdrew, the drinking and looting began. Those who took part in the looting of valuables claimed that the victors were entitled to the spoils of war. And Simms description of the looting of the city is bolstered by other reports as well as correspondence from Union soldiers. These excerpts are from a letter Union Lieutenant Thomas Myers wrote from Camden, S.C. after the burning of Columbia.

"My dear wife.we have had a glorious time in this State. Unrestricted license to burn and plunder was the order of the day.gold watches, silver pitchers, cups, spoons, forks, etc are as common as blackberries. The terms of plunder are as follows: Each company is required to exhibit the results of its operations at any given place, -one-fifth and first choice falls to the share of the commander-in-chief and staff, one-fifth to the corps commanders and staff, one-fifth to field officers of regiments, and two-fifths to the company. " Then Lieutenant Myers makes this statement:

"Officers are not allowed to join these expeditions without disguising themselves as privates." And, finally, this telling comment:" General Sherman has silver and gold enough to start a bank. His share in gold watches alone at Columbia was two hundred and seventy-five."

Some smoldering cotton bales were found and quickly extinguished by Union troops when they took possession of the city but there were no other significant fires. However, shortly after dusk "while the Mayor was conversing with one of the Western men, from Iowa, three rockets were shot up by the enemy from the Capitol Square. As the soldier beheld these rockets, he cried out: "Alas! Alas! For your poor city! It is doomed. These rockets are the signal! The town is to be fired." Shortly thereafter, flames broke out around the city. "As the flames spread from house to house, you could behold, through long vistas of the lurid empire of flames and gloom, the miserable tenants of the once peaceful home issuing forth in dismay, bearing the chattels most useful or precious, and seeking escape through the narrow channels which the flames left them."

Not only were Union troops seen starting fires, they were also observed preventing firemen from extinguishing blazing buildings. "Engines and hose were brought out by the firemen, but these were soon driven from their labors-which were indeed idle against such a storm of fire-by the pertinacious hostility of the soldiers; the hose was hewn to pieces, and the foremen, dreading worse usage to themselves, left the field in despair."

---READ MORE IF YOU CAN STOMACH IT, PETERSON, AT: http://www.lewrockwell.com/jarvis/jarvis19.html

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FROM "A WOMAN'S WARTIME JOURNAL." IF THIS ISN'T "RAUCOUS VIKINGS COMING DOWN FROM THE NORTH TO DESTROY THE SOUTH," THEN YOU DON'T UNDERSTAND THE MEANING OF THE WORDS. NOTE HOW THE DAMNYANKEES MENTALLY TORTURED PEOPLE BY TELLING THEM THEIR LOVED ONES HAD BEEN KILLED WHEN THEY HADN'T.

TRY TO DEFEND THIS, PETERSON. JUST TRY.

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SUNDAY, JULY 24, 1864.

No church. Our preachers horse stolen by the Yankees. This raid is headed by Guerrard and is for the purpose of destroying our railroads. They cruelly shot a George Daniel and a Mr. Jones of Covington, destroyed a great deal of private property, and took many citizens prisoners.

JULY 29, 1864.

Sleepless nights. The report is that the Yankees have left Covington for Macon, headed by Stoneman, to release prisoners held there. They robbed every house on the road of its provisions, sometimes taking every piece of meat, blankets and wearing apparel, silver and arms of every description. They would take silk dresses and put them under their saddles, and many other things for which they had no use. Is this the way to make us love them and their Union? Let the poor people answer whom they have deprived of every mouthful of meat and of their livestock to make any! Our mills, too, they have burned, destroying an immense amount of property.

NOVEMBER 19, 1864.

Slept in my clothes last night, as I heard that the Yankees went to neighbor Montgomery's on Thursday night at one o'clock, searched his house, drank his wine, and took his money and valuables. As we were not disturbed, I walked after breakfast, with Sadai, up to Mr. Joe Perry's, my nearest neighbor, where the Yankees were yesterday. Saw Mrs. Laura [Perry] in the road surrounded by her children, seeming to be looking for some one. She said she was looking for her husband, that old Mrs. Perry had just sent her word that the Yankees went to James Perry's the night before, plundered his house, and drove off all his stock, and that she must drive hers into the old fields. Before we we were done talking, up came Joe and Jim Perry from their hiding-place. Jim was very much excited. Happening to turn and look behind, as we stood there, I saw some blue-coats coming down the hill. Jim immediately raised his gun, swearing he would kill them anyhow.

"No, don't!" said I, and ran home as fast as I could, with Sadai.

I could hear them cry, "Halt! Halt!" and their guns went off in quick succession. Oh God, the time of trial has come!

A man passed on his way to Covington. I halloed to him, asking him if he did not know the Yankees were coming.

"No - are they?"

"Yes," said I; "they are not three hundred yards from here."

"Sure enough," said he. "Well, I'll not go. I don't want them to get my horse." And although within hearing of their guns, he would stop and look for them. Blissful ignorance! Not knowing, not hearing, he has not suffered the suspense, the fear, that I have for the past forty-eight hours. I walked to the gate. There they came filing up.

I hastened back to my frightened servants and told them that they had better hide, and then went back to the gate to claim protection and a guard. But like demons they rush in! My yards are full. To my smoke-house, my dairy, pantry, kitchen, and cellar, like famished wolves they come, breaking locks and whatever is in their way. The thousand pounds of meat in my smoke-house is gone in a twinkling, my flour, my meat, my lard, butter, eggs, pickles of various kinds - both in vinegar and brine -wine, jars, and jugs are all gone. My eighteen fat turkeys, my hens, chickens, and fowls, my young pigs, are shot down in my yard and hunted as if they were rebels themselves. Utterly powerless I ran out and appealed to the guard.

"I cannot help you, Madam; it is orders."

As I stood there, from my lot I saw driven, first, old Dutch, my dear old buggy horse, who has carried my beloved husband so many miles, and who would so quietly wait at the block for him to mount and dismount, and who at last drew him to his grave; then came old Mary, my brood mare, who for years had been too old and stiff for work, with her three-year-old colt, my two-year-old mule, and her last little baby colt. There they go! There go my mules, my sheep, and, worse than all, my boys [slaves]!

Alas! little did I think while trying to save my house from plunder and fire that they were forcing my boys from home at the point of the bayonet. One, Newton, jumped into bed in his cabin, and declared himself sick. Another crawled under the floor, - a lame boy he was, - but they pulled him out, placed him on a horse, and drove him off. Mid, poor Mid! The last I saw of him, a man had him going around the garden, looking, as I thought, for my sheep, as he was my shepherd. Jack came crying to me, the big tears coursing down his cheeks, saying they were making him go. I said:

"Stay in my room."

But a man followed in, cursing him and threatening to shoot him if he did not go; so poor Jack had to yield. James Arnold, in trying to escape from a back window, was captured and marched off. Henry, too, was taken; I know not how or when, but probably when he and Bob went after the mules. I had not believed they would force from their homes the poor, doomed negroes, but such has been the fact here, cursing them and saying that "Jeff Davis wanted to put them in his army, but that they should not fight for him, but for the Union." No! Indeed no! They are not friends to the slave. We have never made the poor, cowardly negro fight, and it is strange, passing strange, that the all-powerful Yankee nation with the whole world to back them, their ports open, their armies filled with soldiers from all nations, should at last take the poor negro to help them out against this little Confederacy which was to have been brought back into the Union in sixty days' time!

My poor boys! My poor boys ! What unknown trials are before you! How you have clung to your mistress and assisted her in every way you knew.

Never have I corrected them; a word was sufficient. Never have they known want of any kind. Their parents are with me, and how sadly they lament the loss of their boys. Their cabins are rifled of every valuable, the soldiers swearing that their Sunday clothes were the white people's, and that they never had money to get such things as they had. Poor Frank's chest was broken open, his money and tobacco taken. He has always been a money-making and saving boy; not infrequently has his crop brought him five hundred dollars and more. All of his clothes and Rachel's clothes, which dear Lou gave before her death and which she had packed away, were stolen from her. Ovens, skillets, coffee-mills, of which we had three, coffee-pots -not one have I left. Sifters all gone!

Seeing that the soldiers could not be restrained, the guard offered me to have their [of the negroes] remaining possessions brought into my house, which I did, and they all, poor things, huddled together in my room, fearing every movement that the house would be burned.

A Captain Webber from Illinois came into my house. Of him I claimed protection from the vandals who were forcing themselves into my room. He said that he knew my brother Orrington [the late Orrington Lunt, a well known early settler of Chicago]. At that name I could not restrain my feelings, but, bursting into tears, implored him to see my brother and let him know my destitution. I saw nothing before me but starvation. He promised to do this, and comforted me with the assurance that my dwelling-house would not be burned, though my out-buildings might. Poor little Sadai went crying to him as to a friend and told him that they had taken her doll, Nancy. He begged her to come and see him, and he would give her a fine waxen one. [The doll was found later in the yard of a neighbor, where a soldier had thrown it, and was returned to the little girl. Her children later played with it, and it is now the plaything of her granddaughter.]

He felt for me, and I give him and several others the character of gentlemen. I don't believe they would have molested women and children had they had their own way. He seemed surprised that I had not laid away in my house, flour and other provisions. I did not suppose I could secure them there, more than where I usually kept them, for in last summer's raid houses were thoroughly searched. In parting with him; I parted as with a friend.

Sherman himself and a greater portion of his army passed my house that day. All day, as the sad moments rolled on, were they passing not only in front of my house, but from behind; they tore down my garden palings, made a road through my back-yard and lot field, driving their stock and riding through, tearing down my fences and desolating my home - wantonly doing it when there was no necessity for it.

Such a day, if I live to the age of Methuselah, may God spare me from ever seeing again!

As night drew its sable curtains around us, the heavens from every point were lit up with flames from burning buildings. Dinnerless and supperless as we were, it was nothing in comparison with the fear of being driven out homeless to the dreary woods. Nothing to eat! I could give my guard no supper, so he left us. I appealed to another, asking him if he had wife, mother, or sister, and how he should feel were they in my situation. A colonel from Vermont left me two men, but they were Dutch, and I could not understand one word they said.

My Heavenly Father alone saved me from the destructive fire. My carriage-house had in it eight bales of cotton, with my carriage, buggy, and harness. On top of the cotton were some carded cotton rolls, a hundred pounds or more. These were thrown out of the blanket in which they were, and a large twist of the rolls taken and set on fire, and thrown into the boat of my carriage, which was close up to the cotton bales. Thanks to my God, the cotton only burned over, and then went out. Shall I ever forget the deliverance?

To-night, when the greater part of the army had passed, it came up very windy and cold. My room was full, nearly, with the negroes and their bedding. They were afraid to go out, for my women could not step out of the door without an insult from the Yankee soldiers. They lay down on the floor; Sadai got down and under the same cover with Sally, while I sat up all night, watching every moment for the flames to burst out from some of my buildings. The two guards came into my room and laid themselves by my fire for the night. I could not close my eyes, but kept walking to and fro, watching the fires in the distance and dreading the approaching day, which, I feared, as they had not all passed, would be but a continuation of horrors.

NOVEMBER 20, 1864.

This is the blessed Sabbath, the day upon which He who came to bring peace and good will upon earth rose from His tomb and ascended to intercede for us poor fallen creatures. But how unlike this day to any that have preceded it in my once quiet home. I had watched all night, and the dawn found me watching for the moving of the soldiery that was encamped about us. Oh, how I dreaded those that were to pass, as I supposed they would straggle and complete the ruin that the others had commenced, for I had been repeatedly told that they would burn everything as they passed.

Some of my women had gathered up a chicken that the soldiers shot yesterday, and they cooked it with some yams for our breakfast, the guard complaining that we gave them no supper. They gave us some coffee, which I had to make in a tea-kettle, as every coffeepot is taken off. The rear-guard was commanded by Colonel Carlow, who changed our guard, leaving us one soldier while they were passing. They marched directly on, scarcely breaking ranks. Once a bucket of water was called for, but they drank without coming in.

About ten o'clock they had all passed save one, who came in and wanted coffee made, which was done, and he, too, went on. A few minutes elapsed, and two couriers riding rapidly passed back. Then, presently, more soldiers came by, and this ended the passing of Sherman's army by my place, leaving me poorer by thirty thousand dollars than I was yesterday morning. And a much stronger Rebel!

After the excitement was a little over, I went up to Mrs. Laura's to sympathize with her, for I had no doubt but that her husband was hanged. She thought so, and we could see no way for his escape. We all took a good cry together. While there, I saw smoke looming up in the direction of my home, and thought surely the fiends had done their work ere they left. I ran as fast as I could, but soon saw that the fire was below my home. It proved to be the gin house [cotton gin] belonging to Colonel Pitts.

My boys have not come home. I fear they cannot get away from the soldiers. Two of my cows came up this morning, but were driven off again by the Yankees.

I feel so thankful that I have not been burned out that I have tried to spend the remainder of the day as the Sabbath ought to be spent. Ate dinner out of the oven in Julia's [the cook's] house, some stew, no bread. She is boiling some corn. My poor servants feel so badly at losing what they have worked for; meat, the hog meat that they love better than anything else, is all gone.

NOVEMBER 21, 1864.

We had the table laid this morning, but no bread or butter or milk. What a prospect for delicacies! My house is a perfect fright. I had brought in Saturday night some thirty bushels of potatoes and ten or fifteen bushels of wheat poured down on the carpet in the ell. Then the few gallons of syrup saved was daubed all about. The backbone of a hog that I had killed on Friday, and which the Yankees did not take when they cleaned out my smokehouse, I found and hid under my bed, and this is all the meat I have.

Major Lee came down this evening, having heard that I was burned out, to proffer me a home. Mr. Dorsett was with him. The army lost some of their beeves in passing. I sent to-day and had some driven into my lot, and then sent to Judge Glass to come over and get some. Had two killed. Some of Wheeler's men came in, and I asked them to shoot the cattle, which they did.

About ten o'clock this morning Mr. Joe Perry [Mrs. Laura's husband] called. I was so glad to see him that I could scarcely forbear embracing him. I could not keep from crying, for I was sure the Yankees had executed him, and I felt so much for his poor wife. The soldiers told me repeatedly Saturday that they had hung him and his brother James and George Guise. They had a narrow escape, however, and only got away by knowing the country so much better than the soldiers did. They lay out until this morning. How rejoiced I am for his family! All of his negroes are gone, save one man that had a wife here at my plantation. They are very strong Secesh [Secessionists]. When the army first came along they offered a guard for the house, but Mrs. Laura told them she was guarded by a Higher Power, and did not thank them to do it. She says that she could think of nothing else all day when the army was passing but of the devil and his hosts. She had, however, to call for a guard before night or the soldiers would have taken everything she had.

NOVEMBER 22, 1864.

After breakfast this morning I went over to my grave-yard to see what had befallen that. To my joy, I found it had not been disturbed. As I stood by my dead, I felt rejoiced that they were at rest. Never have I felt so perfectly reconciled to the death of my husband as I do to-day, while looking upon the ruin of his lifelong labor. How it would have grieved him to see such destruction! Yes, theirs is the lot to be envied. At rest, rest from care, rest from heartaches, from trouble. . . .

Found one of my large hogs killed just outside the grave-yard.

Walked down to the swamp, looking for the wagon and gear that Henry hid before he was taken off. Found some of my sheep; came home very much wearied, having walked over four miles.

Mr. and Mrs. Rockmore called. Major Lee came down again after some cattle, and while he was here the alarm was given that more Yankees were coming. I was terribly alarmed and packed my trunks with clothing, feeling assured that we should be burned out now. Major Lee swore that he would shoot, which frightened me, for he was intoxicated enough to make him ambitious. He rode off in the direction whence it was said they were coming, Soon after, however, he returned, saying it was a false alarm, that it was some of our own men. Oh, dear! Are we to be always living in fear and dread! Oh, the horrors, the horrors of war!

NOVEMBER 26, 1864.

A very cold morning. Elbert [the negro coachman] has to go to mill this morning, and I shall go with him, fearing that, if he is alone, my mule may be taken from him, for there are still many straggling soldiers about. Mounted in the little wagon, I went, carrying wheat not only for myself, but for my neighbors. Never did I think I would have to go to mill! Such are the changes that come to us! History tells us of some illustrious examples of this kind. Got home just at night.

Mr. Kennedy stopped all night with us. He has been refugeeing on his way home. Every one we meet gives us painful accounts of the desolation caused by the enemy. Each one has to tell his or her own experience, and fellow-suffering makes us all equal and makes us all feel interested in one another. Tuesday, the nineteenth of the month, I attended Floyd Glass's wedding. She was married in the morning to Lieutenant Doroughty. She expected to have been married the week after the Yankees came, but her groom was not able to get here. Some of the Yankees found out in some way that she was to have been married, and annoyed her considerably by telling her that they had taken her sweetheart prisoner; that when he got off the train at the Circle they took him and, some said, shot him.

The Yankees found Mrs. Glass's china and glassware that she had buried in a box, broke it all up, and then sent her word that she would set no more fine tables. They also got Mrs. Perry's silver.

<http://docsouth.unc.edu/burge/lunt.html>

----------------------------------------------

HERE'S MORE 'YANKEE GOOD GUY' BEHAVIOR, FROM THE OFFICIAL RECORDS.

"About the same time a body of them proceeded, as I am informed by the Union men of Warrensburg, to the house of one Mr. Burgess, and shot him and his brother and burned the house over the heads of his family.

"Again on Sunday, the 30th, Captain Thomas W. Houts [Missouri State Militia, commanding Post, Warrensburg] while out with a party of some fifty men, killed one Mr. Piper, and burned five dwellings, turning the families out of doors and destroying everything in the houses..." -- reported by Captain James D. Thompson, First Iowa Calvary, March 30, 1862, from the Official Records, vol. VIII: 641-642

====

"William B. Mumford, who, after the raising of the flag of the United States upon the U.S. Mint by Flag-officer Farragut, pulled it down, dragged it through the streets...tore it in shreds...was tried, condemned, and executed on ...the seventh instant, on the spot where he committed his heinous crime." -- reported by butler, June 10, 1862, from the Official Records [note: William B. Mumford was a teenaged boy] vol. XV 465-466

====

"The mother and wife of ...White came to see me, and reported that Boicourt of Sixth ...came to the house, arrested...White...23 years old, delicate in health, and never a guerilla, but, on the contrary, peacefully disposed of and of Union sentiments....When White was taken in custody, he was taken out through the yard, and, when near the gate, resisted, and finally attempted to escape, when he was killed, partly with blows and shots. The house of White was burned down." -- reported by w.t. sherman, November 19, 1862, 13 miles south of Memphis, from the Official Records, vol. XVII, pt, II: 77

====

"Cannot something be done to lessen the perpetration of crime by the paroled soldiers kept at Annapolis? Drunkenness, fighting, burglary, robbery, gambling, &tc., are witnessed by us daily, and even murder is not of unfrequent occurrence...." -- reported by Private McKendree Shaw, Company D, Forty-Fourth New York, Camp Parole, Annapolis, Maryland, November 18,1862, to Secretary of War Stanton, from the Official Records, ser. II, vol. IV: 727

====

"The crimes of ...murder, arson, rape, and others are increasing, and the power to check them by inflicting the penalty of death is a nullity, for [with] the delays necessary to get them a regular trial by general court-martial, and then holding them until the matter is reviewed by the President, such a time elapses that the troops are relieved and the culprit escapes." -- reported to Secretary of War Stanton by Rosecrans, commanding Army of the Cumberland, in Murfreesborough, Tennessee, on January 11, 1863, from the Official Records, vol. XX, pt. II: 318

====

"I send this that...the general...may apply remedy...to the shame incident to the murders committed by the troops in their scouts. Since Saturday morning, there has been as many as four murders committed by our soldiers...The men murdered were [John B.] Wright, two Bunches [John Bunch and William Bunch], and [Port] Thornton, which, added to [Joseph] Harvey, and [James] Scuggs, makes the number six within the last ten or twelve days..." -- reported by Lieutenant Colonel Theodore A. Switzler, provost marshal, Warsaw, Missouri, August 11, 1863, from the Official Records, vol. XXII, pt II: 473

====

"This is the same lot of men...accused of murdering Austin Blankinship, John Nelson and William Holland at Cole Camp..." -- reported by George Graham, Jefferson City, Missouri, October 3, 1863, from the Official Records, vol. XXII, pt. II: 599

====

vol. VIII: 641-642
vol. XV 465-466
vol. XVII, pt, II: 77
ser. II, vol. IV: 727
vol. XX, pt. II: 318
vol. XXII, pt II: 473
vol. XXII, pt. II: 599

====

"The most heartless murders have been committed." -- reported by General E. B. Brown, Benton County, Missouri, November 4, 1863, from the Official Records

====

"Jackson Whaley was murdered in his own house. Mr. Youngman's store was robbed. He was shot at..These men are a terror to the country. Many citizens are killed and robbed by them." -- reported by Colonel John B. Rogers, Second Missouri State Militia Calvary, September 18, 1863, from the Official Records

====

"Camped at Widow McCormick's...On the...6th, burned the buildings...Killed ten men...burned twenty-three houses...Upon making report to Captain Murphy for 'special instructions,' he ordered me to 'clean them out.'" -- reported by First Lieutenant John W. Boyd, Company I, Sixth Provisional Regiment Enrolled Missouri Calvary, November 5, 1863, from the Official Records

====

"Numerous complaints have reached division headquarters this morning of depredations committed upon peaceable and unoffending citizens by some of the troops in this command. This evil has grown intolerable." -- reported by Brigadier General Rufus King, commanding Division, of Major General Irvin McDowell's First Corps, McClellan's Army of the Potomac, on April 7, 1862

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AND YET MORE 'DAMNYANKEE GOOD GUY BEHAVIOR" FROM THOSE 'NOBLE' NORTHERNERS WHO INVADED THE CIVILIANS OF FREDERICKSBURG AND LAID THEIR TOWN WASTE:

----------

The modern tendency to reject Southern testimony -- unless it fits current prescriptions -- as casuistry or outright lies would disregard horrified accounts by Confederate witnesses. The following medley of contemporary descriptions comes exclusively from Northern pens. A Union surgeon: "The scenes of wanton destruction and ruin...beggars all description The floor was a foot deep in broken bottles."

A New York officer: "Boys came into our place loaded with silver pitchers, silver spoons, silver lamps Splendid alabaster vases and pieces of statuary were thrown at...700 dollar mirrors Finest cut glass ware goblets were hurled at nice plate glass windows Rosewood pianos piled in the streets & burned or soldiers would get on top of them & kick the keyboard & internal machinery all to pieces Libraries...were overhauled & thrown on the floor & in the streets. I can't begin to describe the scenes of destruction."

Another New York officer: "Now begins the sacking Soldiers were wearing wreaths of false flowers...and silk dresses from the private houses."

An Illinois cavalryman: "I saw the greatest destruction of property that was ever known I got a number of valuable books to send home." An ardent abolitionist with local roots interviewed black townspeople about how the ordeal affected them. Washington Wright, a freedman and sexton of St. George's Church, accosted a soldier carrying off a silver chalice from the sanctuary and shamed him into abandoning it. The rest of the church plate disappeared into looters' haversacks, and soldiers mutilated the organ and destroyed the Bibles and prayer books. Wright had less success with his personal property than with the Episcopal chalice. "The soldiers when they came in got a hearse and loaded it with pillage," he reported. "They cut down our curtains and cut up our carpets and carried off all of our bacon. A man couldn't walk the streets with a watch on."

A girl described the ruins of her home after Yankees had swept through, pouring jam on everything they could not break: "The house looked as if a lot of crazy people had been turned loose there." A soldier from Richmond told his mother that Fredericksburg would "make you weep to see it." A Confederate staff officer quoted General Lee as saying quietly: "These people like to make war on the defenseless. It just suits them."

---

MAKING WAR ON THE DEFENSELESS -- THE HALLMARK OF DAMNYANKEE WARFARE. MAKES YOU PROUD TO BE AN AMERICAN, DON'T IT, PETERSON?

WANT M-O-O-O-O-RE?

At Andersonville, yankee prisoners of war ate exactly the same thing, and the same amount, that their Southern guards ate. ALL suffered privation because there was little food and no medicine for them, thanks to the Union blockade of Southern ports and the Union army war on Southern civilians (the suppliers of food for the South). Northern soldiers languished at Andersonville because the Union refused the Confederacy's pleas to exchange prisoners.

Go read about, Elmira, where Southern soldiers were deliberately starved, deliberately infected with disease and deliberately exposed to killing cold --in a land of plenty; "Hell-mira," where blankets and clothing sent to prisoners by their families in the South were burned by order of U.S. commissary-general of prisoners, Col. William Hoffman; Hell-mira, where yankee civilians paid fifteen cents to sit in stands and watch Confederate soldiers like it was some kind of carnival side show. They even had concession stands, where the yankee civilian spectators could buy treats and "lemon pop" to eat while Southern prisoners were fed starvation diets and had to drink from a disease-laden pond.

http://www.rootsweb.com/~albarbou/CSA/elmira_prison.htm

GLORY, GLORY HALLELUJAH, DON'T THAT MAKE YOU PROUD TO BE AN AMERICAN, PETERSON? AND IF THAT DON'T DO IT, HOW ABOUT THE DELIBERATE TORTURE INFLICTED ON SOUTHERN SOLDIERS BY THE 'GOOD GUY DAMNYANKEES' AT CAMP DOUGLAS.

There were some of our poor boys, for little infraction of the prison rules, riding what they called Morgan?s mule every day. That was one mule that did the worst standing stock still. He was built after the pattern of those used by carpenters. He was about fifteen feet high; the legs were nailed to the scantling so one of the sharp edges was turned up, which made it very painful and uncomfortable to the poor fellow especially when he had to be ridden bareback, sometimes with heavy weights fastened to his feet and sometimes with a large beef bone in each hand. This performance was carried on under the eyes of a guard with a loaded gun, and was kept up for several days; each ride lasting two hours each day unless the fellow fainted and fell off from pain and exhaustion. Very few were able to walk after this hellish Yankee torture but had to be supported to their barracks. (EXPERIENCE OF A CONFEDERATE SOLDIER IN CAMP AND PRISON IN THE CIVIL WAR 1861-1865 by Milton Ashbury Ryan.) http://www.izzy.net/~michaelg/ma-ryan.htm

HERE'S THE BOTTOM LINE, PETERSON. HONOR YOUR ANCESTORS IF YOU WANT TO -- BUT DON'T EXPECT SOUTHERNERS WHO KNOW THE TRUTH TO EVER BUY INTO THE MYTH, FABLE, REVISIONIST HISTORY -- DOWN RIGHT LIE -- THAT THE DAMNYANKEES WERE THE 'GOOD GUYS."


Connie Ward
P.O. Box XXXX
Pensacola, FL XXXXX

Reply from the yankee (with spelling & grammar as they arrived):

You guys always forget that those people he adopted stern measures against were PARTISANS and GUERILLAS. I general the Yankees were the good guys. There cause was just. We weren't enslaving 20 million people while extolling the virtues of liberty.

Here is a list of murderers for you:
Henry Wirz
William Quantrill
John Hunt Morgan
Nathan Bedford Forest

The list could be longer but I want to keep this brief. And the Yankees showed a great deal of restraint at the end of the war. We tried to effect a reconcilliation rather than execute and imprision all the rebel leaders which most victors are want to do throughout history.

I'm not going to change your mind so I won't reply to any more of your revisionist claims!

Eric
Okay, dear readers -- your mission, should you decide to take it, is to devise a new math that will explain how there could be 20 million people enslaved in a country with a total population of approximately 9 million.

Moreover, somebody please explain to me how anybody could construe reconstruction to be compatible with "restraint."

Finally, since the bulk of my post was from sources written during the war era, anybody want to try to point out the "revisionist claims" in it?

I thought not. Maybe Redleg Eric DOES need to start a SUV chapter though -- and make the acquaintance of folks who know what really happened back then!

[BLUEHAWK]

Jerry -
I have reread your post and this whole thread a few times... damn good work on your part I'd say.... heard it was gonna get front page above the fold in the NY Times this coming sunday!

Bless you and Bill, for keeping the circle unbroken.

[MORTARDUDE]

Mike :

What exactly is going to be in the NY Times this Sunday ? Please post it here so I don't forget. Thanks.

Larry

[Jerry D]

Mike :
Same here let us know also .
thanks...