How and What to tell the young

[Packo]

"The Green Berets" by Robin Moore. It is not the movie. The book really goes into what the Green Berets were doing, and it was working with the villagers, not killing them. I think you will find it is a great book. Also S.L.A. Marshalls, "Vietnam, 3 Battles". Great historic account of 3 battles in Vietnam. A very close, dead buddy of mine, from AOcancer, is written up in it when he was a Screaming Eagle. It would be a great legacy to him to know that High School and College kids were really learning about the hardship and courage it took to be an American Infantryman in Vietnam. Some of that other stuff, like Platoon, is truly bull shit, but great to contrast it with the truth. It would be great to have Vets tell them after Platoon, "had that been my Platoon, I'd a shot half of them myself!".

Having taught at Park University for 9 years, (Sociology), I know how hard it is to put together a good class. Your "silly bus" looks great. Good luck. Oh, yeah, certainly Hal Moores book, "We were soldiers once and young." That, I think, is extremely important.

Have fun, and wish I could have taught that instead of Sosh!

Packo

[sfc_darrel]

100% agreement
"The Green Berets" by Robin Moore. It is not the movie. The book really goes into what the Green Berets were doing, and it was working with the villagers, not killing them.

Also not me but friends...

served on a CAP Team and lived in a Vietnamese peasant-farming village under the Marine Corps' Combined Action Program (CAP.) http://www.capveterans.com/
Anti-Terrorist Teams experienced tremendous combat, we were known mostly for our kindness to the Vietnamese families that we lived with, protected and helped. CAP Teams had the nickname: "The Peace Corps Volunteers with Rifles."

I don't know how hard this would be in your area but try to find a first generation Vietnamese immigrant . The ones I've known have been grateful for all our help and sorry we had to leave.

I've known doctors, engineers, students, former boat people, children of men that were in the bamboo prison for years after the war was lost.

Another perspective.

[usmcsgt65]

First off, you got a lot time to teach about the Vietnam experience. When I teaching it, it was a part of the general US History course and a smaller one in the World History course.

My big trick is what we do in the form here. I brought in Vietnam veteran to talk about their experiences, brought in went to college to avoid the draft people, and a couple of anti-war activists.

Used Karlow's Vietnam as the outside reading source, and the 13 part video.

[1CAVCCO15MED]

Are just that: movies. They are someone's opinion, usually someone who has no real understanding of the complexities of the situation. There are no movies about Vietnam that show any true realism with the possible exception of We Were Soldiers. Platoon was directed by Oliver Stone. He was an infantry soldier in Vietnam but if you compare Platoon to his other films you will see he doesn't let the truth stand in the way of a good story. Another book, Incursion, by JD Coleman. It is important because it explains what went on after the Tet Offensive and the replacement of Westmoreland with Abrams. It explains what led up to the Cambodian invasion and how tactics changed. What was done by Abrams would have won the war if he had been put in charge first instead of Westmoreland the MBA.

[SuperScout]

Like Gimpy, I would not only avoid "Platoon" as any type of factual representation of us warriors, but I would vilify Stone for the historical revisionist that he is.
Recommended Books to Add or replace others:
The Viet Cong, by Douglas Pike
The Lost Revolution, by Robert Shaplen
The Emancipation of French Indo-China, by Donald Lancaster
Any books by Keith Nolan, a young, and so for, highly accurate military historian.

Part of my contribution to the history facgts department is my presentation to local hight schools about my tours, complete with slide show. Lottsa fun, and great attention from the students!
Scouts Out!!

[chilidog]

I'm not a vet, so I really don't carry any weight, but I feel that Keith Nolan's books have helped me understand more about Vietnam and Vets than any other books have.

chilidog

[Arrow]

There's no doubt a great deal of time and effort has gone into the planning of your class. I hold in question some of the reading and viewing material however. I am afraid you are going down an old familiar trail that will leave those that attend with the same myths that Hollywood and the media has spoonfed the American people with for lo these many years. I don't want to be unkind but I would have to pass on the class. I am afraid it would take me down that same rabbit trail we have all been on for years.

vvar.homestead.com/main.html

http://www.afio.com/sections/book_re...etter_war.html

[Cwilkens]

To one and all

Thanks for your input and suggestions. I will consider them in my planning for the next school year and next semester at college?

The high school course runs 17 weeks and a final examination. It uses as text materials the following books.

The text-
"Vietnam" by Tony Murdoch, Joan M. Crouse, Pam O'Connell

The Readings text-
"The Vietnam War - A Historical Reader" by Nextext Corporation

The Opposing Views Reader-
"The Vietnam War - Opposing Viewpoints" is a series by The American History Series

I have a wide range of materials and film available at school and of my own personal collection.

The problem that I have to deal with is if I want to bring a new text or reader, the process from introduction to adoption by the board is a minimum of 5 months maybe more. It tends to slow down major changes in the course to a crawl.

My college course is some what unique. It is offered as a winter session course meaning it is taught between the Fall and Spring semesters of the college. It usually runs Monday thru Thursday for two and a half weeks.

41/2 hours each night for ten days = 45 classroom hours = 3 history credits. There is not a lot of time for research, reading and term papers.

There are great discussions. Lots of activities involving multimedia sources. The films (movies/documentaries/news pieces/government films/ alternative films/ independent films) all are a part of the course.

The two most favorite nights is the "Music" night where AFRVN comes to life. One of my friends comes in with some of his equipment and it becomes "golden Oldies" night as we explore the 'Rock n Roll" war and the music at home as well.

The other is the Viet Vet Panel night, usually 5 or 6 vets from the local area come in and talk to the students about their tours and answer questions.

The text-
"The Lessons of the Vietnam War" by Professor Gerald Starr, editor.

The reader-
"The Vietnam Reader" edited by Stewart O'Nan

I also use "On Strategy" by Harry G. Summers for overall analysis of the war and its outcome.

These cover a wide range of points of view which allows for discussion and questions about the war in a short period of time.

cwilkens/ 716 MP BN/ Saigon/ 1967-68

[Cwilkens]

little sparrow -

I am sorry I could not interest you in the course, but then again, you should not dismiss something out of hand if you have not experienced it in its own right.

I would really appreciate if you and anyone else that does not "agree" with my choice of materials for the history course, please be more specific about "....the rabbit trail we have all been on all these years."

If you feel a film, or text, or reading, or poem is inappropriate tell me why.

I would also appreciate any and all suggestions for materials that should be included in a course on the Vietnam Conflict and the Vietnam Era, if I take out what you and the others think is inappropriate.

Point of information - I rarely show an entire film in class because I neither have the time and most films only have parts that apply to certain topics as the course progresses, ie.students compare scenes in "Hamburger Hill" where the sergeant talks to the 'newbies' about what to expect in the jungle in the A Shau Valley and the scene in "Full Metal Jacket" dealing with fighting in an urban area during the Tet Offensive in 1968.

Thank you for the two new links, especially the Vets for Academic Reform site as I have some issues to explore concerning that topic.

Best wishes, peace and long life

cwilkens/ 716 MP BN/ Saigon/ 1967-68