HR427 Vietnam Human Rights Act -- VC Leaders are Acting like Aggressive and Remorseless Criminals

Dear friends,

With the pending HR427 legislation, The US Congress is contemplating
making non-humanitarian aids to Communist Vietnam contingent upon
Vietnam's certifiable improvements in its human rights practices. The
leaders of the Vietnamese Communist Party immediately start screaming
that the US is interfering in its internal affairs!

Since when is withholding aids and money from someone interfering in
that person's internal affairs? If you decide not to give money to a
bad person, are you interfering or violating that person in anyway?

For the past 60 years, continual abuses of the human rights and human
dignity of the people of Vietnam, on top of the rampant corruption and
exploitations, by the Vietnamese Communist Party are horrific and
shameful, as confirmed by many independent and impartial sources. The
world knows that the leaders of the Vietnamese Communist Party decided
to confine the Ven. Thich Huyen Quang, the 87 year-old ailing Buddhist
monk, in isolation in his own small pagoda in Quang Ngai for the past
20 years. The Rev. Nguyen Van Ly of the Catholic churches was
similarly given 15 years prison term with 3 years house arrest just
for demanding the return of his Church's land and religious freedom.

Hundreds of other dissidents are sentenced to long terms in prison
just for peacefully expressing their views on the failures of the
Vietnamese Communist Party, like lawyer Le Chi Quang, Dr. Pham Hong
Son, jourmalist Nguyen vu Binh, ex-soldier Nguyen Khac Toan etc… The
montagnards Christians in Vietnam central highlands are continually
persecuted with murders, tortures, poisoning, forced abortions, forced
renunciation of their faiths etc…These are cases well documented by
international uman rights organizations such as Human Rights Watch,
Amnesty International etc…

It is suspected that the gentle montagnards of Vietnam are being
persecuted because the uneducated, narrow-minded and paranoid leaders
of the Vietnamese Communist Party consider everyone affiliated with
the Protestant faith as potential CIA operatives!

The people of Vietnam is now one of the poorest and most oppressed in
the world, with US$400 average income per person per year. They have
no freedoms of religion, of expression, of forming labor unions or
political parties to compete with the Communists. The people of
Vietnam is just modern-day slaves to the obstinate, shameless, corrupt
and murderous leaders of the Vietnamese Communist Party.

What the leaders of the Vietnamese Communist Party are now doing with
the proposed legislation HR-427 in the US is to act like the
remorseless criminals, robbing and raping the victims, then loudly and
aggressively blaming the victims for the crimes, hoping to bully the
rest of the world into complying with its terms!

We urge all conscientious people of the world to work very closely
with your respective governments to make sure your hard-earned tax
money will not be given to the corrupt, extremely wealthy and
supremely powerful members of the Vietnamese Communist Party to
finance their lavish lifestyles, and to procure means to further
oppress and abuse the people of Vietnam.

We urge that we all work to make sure all aids to Vietnam are focused
on improving human rights for the people of Vietnam, are fully
accountable, and are strongly managed, with clearly-stated goals,
reward and punishment incentives, for the leaders of the Vietnamese
Communist Party.

We urge that all conscientious people of the world organize to effect
immediate expulsion of the Socialist Republic of Vietnam from the
United Nations' membership for its blatant, continuous and willful
violations of the UN's Universal Declarations of Human Rights and its
covenants on political and civil rights.

Sincerely,

Tam D. Doan
Liberty Flame

************************************************** **********************
http://www.vov.org.vn/2003_12_08/english/chinhtri1.htm

Politics
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Vietnam, US bolster bilateral co-operation

Deputy Prime Minister Vu Khoan has asked the US to bolster cooperation
with Vietnam to resolve post-war issues with a focus on the
consequences of Agent Orange.

During his visit to Washington D.C from Dec. 4-7, Vu Khoan held talks
and met with US Secretary of State Colin Powell, National Security
Advisor Codoleezza Rice, Trade Representative Robert Zoellick,
Secretary of Agriculture Ann Veneman, Acting Secretary of Commerce
Samuel Bodman, Senator Chuck Hagel, Representative Roy Blunt, and
leaders of major corporations and media organisations.

In a frank atmosphere of mutual respect and understanding, the
Vietnamese and US officials expressed their delight at recent positive
developments in bilateral relations. Both sides praised the efficiency
of the Vietnam-US Bilateral Trade Agreement, which has, in two years,
made the US Vietnam's largest trading partner. Trade between the two
countries now reaches around US$ 5 billion.

Deputy PM Khoan and US officials shared the view that potential for
mutually-beneficial co-operation between the two countries is great,
requiring them both to exert more effort to realise it fully.

To this end, they discussed measures to secure stable, long-term
co-operation between the two countries, emphasising respect for
independence, sovereignty, and mutually beneficial co-operation on an
equal footing.

Regarding differences and disputes arising in bilateral relations,
they believed that these matters should be resolved through
constructive dialogues and mutual understanding.

US leaders and members of congress lauded Vietnam's achievements in
its renewal process, as well as its goodwill and cooperation in the
search for MIAs, and in the fight against terrorism and trans-national
crime.

They affirmed their support for Vietnam's accession to the World Trade
Organisation (WTO), and expressed their willingness to expand
co-operation with the country in trade, technology, agriculture,
education and human resource development.

Vu Khoan reiterated Vietnam's foreign policy of openness and active
international integration, as well as efforts to promote equal and
mutually beneficial co-operation with the US.

However, Vietnam opposed any attempt to interfere in its internal
affairs, particularly Resolution H.R 427, which was recently adopted
by the House of Representatives. Demands were also made that the US
rescind the Jackson-Vanik Amendment for Vietnam, Khoan said.

Meanwhile, in an interview granted to the Washington Times on
Saturday, Khoan said Vietnam wishes to develop stable relations with
the US, and wants the Americans to change their thinking about
Vietnam. Both Vietnam and the US have moved a long way toward becoming
friendly states from enemies in the past.

Khoan said his visit this time aimed to build more stable bilateral
relations with the US through discussions with US leaders. He said the
two countries have been cooperating well in fighting terrorism, even
in sharing information and experience in this effort. He hoped that
the US would better cooperate in stopping terrorist acts caused by
some overseas Vietnamese residing in the US. He cited some cases as
throwing explosives into the Vietnamese Embassies in Thailand and the
Philippines in 2000, and hijacking a Thai aircraft in an attempt to
drop bombs in Vietnam in 2001.

Khoan said the US should cooperate with Vietnam in fighting terrorism,
and take further steps to stop such terrorist acts in the near future.
He condemned the recognition of the former Saigon puppet regime’s
flag as the flag of the overseas Vietnamese community in 21 cities and
Louisiana State.

Khoan also called on the US to view Vietnam as a nation emerging in
stability and prosperity. "We wish to develop relations with the US on
the basis of equality and mutual benefit", Khoan said.

>>>>
With the pending HR427 legislation, The US Congress is contemplating
making non-humanitarian aids to Communist Vietnam contingent upon
Vietnam's certifiable improvements in its human rights practices.
>>>>

As I read your post, I ask myself a couple of questions. What are
non-humanitarian aids the United States give to Vietnam? How many million
dollars? What is the budget of the Socialist Republic of Vietnam annually?
Comparing the SRV's budget to the Non-humanitarian aids, would such
legislation in congress has the power to change anything in Vietnam? To
answer such questions, I went the very popular search engine on the
internet, google.com and typed in some key words such as "United States none
humanitarian aids Vientam". I found a very good link right off the top
that would answer pretty much most of my questions, and here it is:

http://www.usaid.gov/pubs/cbj2003/ane/vn/

The link says the United States give Vietnam about 12 millions dollars of
aids each year focus in two major areas of the economy and healthcare.
First on economy, "The objectives of this program are to strengthen the
Vietnamese private sector, and to help the GOV to deepen trade and
investment related reforms consistent with its commitments in the Bilateral
Trade Agreement. Successful implementation of these reforms will also help
Vietnam meet some of the requirements for accession into the World Trade
Organization (WTO)." said the link. In other words, these aids designed to
strengthen Vietnam's private sector or to help Vietnam's business sector
become more capitalized. Second on healthcare, "USAID's Bureau for Global
Health provides assistance to improve access to services for vulnerable
groups through the Leahy War Victims Fund and the Displaced Children and
Orphan Fund. The HIV/AIDS program helps Vietnam control the spread of
HIV/AIDS by improving surveillance capacity and prevention interventions,
and assisting people living with AIDS. The Office of Foreign Disaster
Assistance helps Vietnam improve its disaster preparedness capacity,
focusing on flood forecasting and mitigation. The United States-Asia
Environmental Partnership (US-AEP) improves Vietnam's overall environmental
financing and regulatory framework and develops decentralized approaches to
urban and natural resource management through partnerships between U.S. and
Vietnamese cities. Finally, USAID provides assistance to women and children
rescued from trafficking."said the link.

Program data sheet allocates to improve help strengthen the Vietnamese
private sector:
http://www.usaid.gov/pubs/cbj2003/ane/vn/440-006.html

Program data sheet allocates to improve Vietnam's health system:
http://www.usaid.gov/pubs/cbj2003/ane/vn/440-007.html

I also searched at google.com to check the United States foreign military
aids to other countries because it is an area which considered to be
non-humanitarian aids. I found a pretty good link also and I look under
Vietnam.
http://www.fas.org/asmp/profiles/aid...bj08-easia.pdf

All the infos are identical to the previous link is that it spells out U.S's
aids to strengthen Vietnam's business sector and healthcare system, except
the pentagon and pacific command add 100,000 dollars to train Vietnamese
military officers to be proficient in English.

The searches were certainly a good educational experience because now I know
why the so called South Vietnamese regime lost the war despite massive U.S's
support. I know why the so called exile Vietnam regime has litte success in
their 30 years quest to bring about democratic changes to Vietnam. Because
they use these stupid methods that shot themselves in the foot and turn the
Vietnamese people against them. I ask myself what sort of people would want
to cut off aids for their country to become more capitalist? Would such
people's ideology similar to the control economy of communist's ideology?
What sort people would want to cut off aids to people with HIV,orphan,
victim of landmine, and flood? Would these people do anything to advance
their political causes at a heavy expense of their own people? I would best
call these people and such legislation of congress are anything, but human
rights and democratic. Instead, I would call them not only pity, but wrong
and evil.

"unknown" wrote in message news:...
> >>>>
> With the pending HR427 legislation, The US Congress is contemplating
> making non-humanitarian aids to Communist Vietnam contingent upon
> Vietnam's certifiable improvements in its human rights practices.
> >>>>
>
> As I read your post, I ask myself a couple of questions. What are
> non-humanitarian aids the United States give to Vietnam? How many million
> dollars? What is the budget of the Socialist Republic of Vietnam annually?
> Comparing the SRV's budget to the Non-humanitarian aids, would such
> legislation in congress has the power to change anything in Vietnam? To
> answer such questions, I went the very popular search engine on the
> internet, google.com and typed in some key words such as "United States none
> humanitarian aids Vientam". I found a very good link right off the top
> that would answer pretty much most of my questions, and here it is:
>
> http://www.usaid.gov/pubs/cbj2003/ane/vn/
>
> The link says the United States give Vietnam about 12 millions dollars of
> aids each year focus in two major areas of the economy and healthcare.
> First on economy, "The objectives of this program are to strengthen the
> Vietnamese private sector, and to help the GOV to deepen trade and
> investment related reforms consistent with its commitments in the Bilateral
> Trade Agreement. Successful implementation of these reforms will also help
> Vietnam meet some of the requirements for accession into the World Trade
> Organization (WTO)." said the link. In other words, these aids designed to
> strengthen Vietnam's private sector or to help Vietnam's business sector
> become more capitalized. Second on healthcare, "USAID's Bureau for Global
> Health provides assistance to improve access to services for vulnerable
> groups through the Leahy War Victims Fund and the Displaced Children and
> Orphan Fund. The HIV/AIDS program helps Vietnam control the spread of
> HIV/AIDS by improving surveillance capacity and prevention interventions,
> and assisting people living with AIDS. The Office of Foreign Disaster
> Assistance helps Vietnam improve its disaster preparedness capacity,
> focusing on flood forecasting and mitigation. The United States-Asia
> Environmental Partnership (US-AEP) improves Vietnam's overall environmental
> financing and regulatory framework and develops decentralized approaches to
> urban and natural resource management through partnerships between U.S. and
> Vietnamese cities. Finally, USAID provides assistance to women and children
> rescued from trafficking."said the link.
>
> Program data sheet allocates to improve help strengthen the Vietnamese
> private sector:
> http://www.usaid.gov/pubs/cbj2003/ane/vn/440-006.html
>
> Program data sheet allocates to improve Vietnam's health system:
> http://www.usaid.gov/pubs/cbj2003/ane/vn/440-007.html
>
> I also searched at google.com to check the United States foreign military
> aids to other countries because it is an area which considered to be
> non-humanitarian aids. I found a pretty good link also and I look under
> Vietnam.
> http://www.fas.org/asmp/profiles/aid...bj08-easia.pdf
>
> All the infos are identical to the previous link is that it spells out U.S's
> aids to strengthen Vietnam's business sector and healthcare system, except
> the pentagon and pacific command add 100,000 dollars to train Vietnamese
> military officers to be proficient in English.
>
> The searches were certainly a good educational experience because now I know
> why the so called South Vietnamese regime lost the war despite massive U.S's
> support. I know why the so called exile Vietnam regime has litte success in
> their 30 years quest to bring about democratic changes to Vietnam. Because
> they use these stupid methods that shot themselves in the foot and turn the
> Vietnamese people against them. I ask myself what sort of people would want
> to cut off aids for their country to become more capitalist? Would such
> people's ideology similar to the control economy of communist's ideology?
> What sort people would want to cut off aids to people with HIV,orphan,
> victim of landmine, and flood? Would these people do anything to advance
> their political causes at a heavy expense of their own people? I would best
> call these people and such legislation of congress are anything, but human
> rights and democratic. Instead, I would call them not only pity, but wrong
> and evil.

Can you tell which ones in your list of aids are humanitarian aids and
which ones are non-humanitarian:

Aid for people with HIV
Aid for orphan
Aid for victims of landmine
Aid for victimes of flood
Aid for training English for Vietnamese officiers

Can you tell which ones of the above aids would be affected by the
HR427?

Can you tell what kind of human right violations committed by the
Vietnamese regime and how serious they are can lead to the ban of
non-humanitarian aids ?

Minh Duc

The U.S. should bar all travel to Vietnam and revoke the passports of anyone
who violates it. They can cut off favored nation status and halt all
imports from landing in the U.S by whatever means. Such sanctions will be
followed by other nations as well. The U.S. can expel all diplomatic
officials from the U.S. and should do so anyway since the Vietnamese are
knowingly aiding terrorism on the global scene and have entered into an
agreement with Fidel Castro to work against the United States.
--------------------

"Minh Duc" wrote in message
news:7d293701.0312141643.4a61b2f@posting.google.co m...
> "unknown" wrote in message
news:...
> > >>>>
> > With the pending HR427 legislation, The US Congress is contemplating
> > making non-humanitarian aids to Communist Vietnam contingent upon
> > Vietnam's certifiable improvements in its human rights practices.
> > >>>>
> >
> > As I read your post, I ask myself a couple of questions. What are
> > non-humanitarian aids the United States give to Vietnam? How many
million
> > dollars? What is the budget of the Socialist Republic of Vietnam
annually?
> > Comparing the SRV's budget to the Non-humanitarian aids, would such
> > legislation in congress has the power to change anything in Vietnam? To
> > answer such questions, I went the very popular search engine on the
> > internet, google.com and typed in some key words such as "United States
none
> > humanitarian aids Vientam". I found a very good link right off the top
> > that would answer pretty much most of my questions, and here it is:
> >
> > http://www.usaid.gov/pubs/cbj2003/ane/vn/
> >
> > The link says the United States give Vietnam about 12 millions dollars
of
> > aids each year focus in two major areas of the economy and healthcare.
> > First on economy, "The objectives of this program are to strengthen the
> > Vietnamese private sector, and to help the GOV to deepen trade and
> > investment related reforms consistent with its commitments in the
Bilateral
> > Trade Agreement. Successful implementation of these reforms will also
help
> > Vietnam meet some of the requirements for accession into the World Trade
> > Organization (WTO)." said the link. In other words, these aids designed
to
> > strengthen Vietnam's private sector or to help Vietnam's business sector
> > become more capitalized. Second on healthcare, "USAID's Bureau for
Global
> > Health provides assistance to improve access to services for vulnerable
> > groups through the Leahy War Victims Fund and the Displaced Children and
> > Orphan Fund. The HIV/AIDS program helps Vietnam control the spread of
> > HIV/AIDS by improving surveillance capacity and prevention
interventions,
> > and assisting people living with AIDS. The Office of Foreign Disaster
> > Assistance helps Vietnam improve its disaster preparedness capacity,
> > focusing on flood forecasting and mitigation. The United States-Asia
> > Environmental Partnership (US-AEP) improves Vietnam's overall
environmental
> > financing and regulatory framework and develops decentralized approaches
to
> > urban and natural resource management through partnerships between U.S.
and
> > Vietnamese cities. Finally, USAID provides assistance to women and
children
> > rescued from trafficking."said the link.
> >
> > Program data sheet allocates to improve help strengthen the Vietnamese
> > private sector:
> > http://www.usaid.gov/pubs/cbj2003/ane/vn/440-006.html
> >
> > Program data sheet allocates to improve Vietnam's health system:
> > http://www.usaid.gov/pubs/cbj2003/ane/vn/440-007.html
> >
> > I also searched at google.com to check the United States foreign
military
> > aids to other countries because it is an area which considered to be
> > non-humanitarian aids. I found a pretty good link also and I look under
> > Vietnam.
> > http://www.fas.org/asmp/profiles/aid...bj08-easia.pdf
> >
> > All the infos are identical to the previous link is that it spells out
U.S's
> > aids to strengthen Vietnam's business sector and healthcare system,
except
> > the pentagon and pacific command add 100,000 dollars to train Vietnamese
> > military officers to be proficient in English.
> >
> > The searches were certainly a good educational experience because now I
know
> > why the so called South Vietnamese regime lost the war despite massive
U.S's
> > support. I know why the so called exile Vietnam regime has litte
success in
> > their 30 years quest to bring about democratic changes to Vietnam.
Because
> > they use these stupid methods that shot themselves in the foot and turn
the
> > Vietnamese people against them. I ask myself what sort of people would
want
> > to cut off aids for their country to become more capitalist? Would such
> > people's ideology similar to the control economy of communist's
ideology?
> > What sort people would want to cut off aids to people with HIV,orphan,
> > victim of landmine, and flood? Would these people do anything to
advance
> > their political causes at a heavy expense of their own people? I would
best
> > call these people and such legislation of congress are anything, but
human
> > rights and democratic. Instead, I would call them not only pity, but
wrong
> > and evil.
>
> Can you tell which ones in your list of aids are humanitarian aids and
> which ones are non-humanitarian:
>
> Aid for people with HIV
> Aid for orphan
> Aid for victims of landmine
> Aid for victimes of flood
> Aid for training English for Vietnamese officiers
>
> Can you tell which ones of the above aids would be affected by the
> HR427?
>
> Can you tell what kind of human right violations committed by the
> Vietnamese regime and how serious they are can lead to the ban of
> non-humanitarian aids ?
>
> Minh Duc

"JASON A. KAATZ" wrote in message news:<7wFDb.433541$pT1.132513@twister.nyc.rr.com>...
> The U.S. should bar all travel to Vietnam and revoke the passports of anyone
> who violates it. They can cut off favored nation status and halt all
> imports from landing in the U.S by whatever means. Such sanctions will be
> followed by other nations as well. The U.S. can expel all diplomatic
> officials from the U.S. and should do so anyway since the Vietnamese are
> knowingly aiding terrorism on the global scene and have entered into an
> agreement with Fidel Castro to work against the United States.

How about China? Should the US do the samething? Surely China is
aiding the North Korea. Why chasing a small fish if you could get a
bigger one?

Cao_Ky@beer.com (Tran Cao Ky) wrote in message news:...
> "JASON A. KAATZ" wrote in message news:<7wFDb.433541$pT1.132513@twister.nyc.rr.com>...
> > The U.S. should bar all travel to Vietnam and revoke the passports of anyone
> > who violates it. They can cut off favored nation status and halt all
> > imports from landing in the U.S by whatever means. Such sanctions will be
> > followed by other nations as well. The U.S. can expel all diplomatic
> > officials from the U.S. and should do so anyway since the Vietnamese are
> > knowingly aiding terrorism on the global scene and have entered into an
> > agreement with Fidel Castro to work against the United States.
>
> How about China? Should the US do the samething? Surely China is
> aiding the North Korea. Why chasing a small fish if you could get a
> bigger one?

Get the small fish first, then we will have experience to get the bigger one!

Come on, comrade TCK! you know thattttttt! ;-))))

Qua'ch Ti?nh ta^n tho+`i...xin kie^'u!
cha^?u...vu't...vu't!

Cao_Ky@beer.com (Tran Cao Ky) wrote in message news:...
> "JASON A. KAATZ" wrote in message news:<7wFDb.433541$pT1.132513@twister.nyc.rr.com>...
> > The U.S. should bar all travel to Vietnam and revoke the passports of anyone
> > who violates it. They can cut off favored nation status and halt all
> > imports from landing in the U.S by whatever means. Such sanctions will be
> > followed by other nations as well. The U.S. can expel all diplomatic
> > officials from the U.S. and should do so anyway since the Vietnamese are
> > knowingly aiding terrorism on the global scene and have entered into an
> > agreement with Fidel Castro to work against the United States.
>
> How about China? Should the US do the samething? Surely China is
> aiding the North Korea. Why chasing a small fish if you could get a
> bigger one?

Because Vietnam had the balls to stand up to America and reject
military base installation.

PLOP

"LIBERTY FLAME / LUA TU DO" wrote in message news:7758c273.0312081213.6bb8bc8a@posting.google.c om...

If China fails to cut of supplying rouge states with WMD capabilities we
could very well see an severe impact on their ability to trade with the
West.


"charles liu" wrote in message
news:1a73ee29.0312170130.7b38979e@posting.google.c om...
> Cao_Ky@beer.com (Tran Cao Ky) wrote in message
news:...
> > "JASON A. KAATZ" wrote in message
news:<7wFDb.433541$pT1.132513@twister.nyc.rr.com>...
> > > The U.S. should bar all travel to Vietnam and revoke the passports of
anyone
> > > who violates it. They can cut off favored nation status and halt all
> > > imports from landing in the U.S by whatever means. Such sanctions
will be
> > > followed by other nations as well. The U.S. can expel all diplomatic
> > > officials from the U.S. and should do so anyway since the Vietnamese
are
> > > knowingly aiding terrorism on the global scene and have entered into
an
> > > agreement with Fidel Castro to work against the United States.
> >
> > How about China? Should the US do the samething? Surely China is
> > aiding the North Korea. Why chasing a small fish if you could get a
> > bigger one?
>
> Because Vietnam had the balls to stand up to America and reject
> military base installation.

Vietnam is not small fish - there was some testimony last years before the
House and/or Senate as to Vietnam having gone into the WMD field. They have
had a CBW program since the early 1960 period. Vietnam is also said to have
developed a new relationship with China ?

-------------

"Tran Cao Ky" wrote in message
news:dbc3e1a7.0312161947.79015b60@posting.google.c om...
> "JASON A. KAATZ" wrote in message
news:<7wFDb.433541$pT1.132513@twister.nyc.rr.com>...
> > The U.S. should bar all travel to Vietnam and revoke the passports of
anyone
> > who violates it. They can cut off favored nation status and halt all
> > imports from landing in the U.S by whatever means. Such sanctions will
be
> > followed by other nations as well. The U.S. can expel all diplomatic
> > officials from the U.S. and should do so anyway since the Vietnamese are
> > knowingly aiding terrorism on the global scene and have entered into an
> > agreement with Fidel Castro to work against the United States.
>
> How about China? Should the US do the samething? Surely China is
> aiding the North Korea. Why chasing a small fish if you could get a
> bigger one?