Antiwar protesters trash 9/11 memorial -- American flags burned and slashed

[MORTARDUDE]

http://www.patriotfiles.com/forum/ne...ead&forumid=26

Antiwar protesters trash 9/11 memorial
American flags burned and slashed
By Debbie Pfeiffer Trunnell, Staff Writer


LA HABRA -- Antiwar protesters burned and ripped up flags, flowers and patriotic signs at a Sept. 11 memorial that residents erected on a fence along Whittier Boulevard days after the terrorist attacks in 2001 and have maintained ever since.

However, although officers witnessed the vandalism Saturday afternoon, police did not arrest three people seen damaging the display because they were "exercising the same freedom of speech that the people who put up the flags were,' La Habra Police Capt. John Rees said Monday.

"For this to be vandalism, there had to be an ill-will intent,' he said.

Rees said in order for police to take any action, the owner of the fence would have to file a complaint.

Jeff Collison, owner of The RV Center in La Habra, who has allowed residents to add patriotic symbols to the fence on his property, said he just might do that.

"Their free speech stops at destruction of private property. If they are allowed to come on my property and burn flags, does that mean I can go to City Hall or the police station and light their flags on fire because that is freedom of speech? To me, this is vandalism,' Collison said.

Some residents Monday hung signs criticizing those who destroyed the display.

Tracey Chandler, a Whittier mother of four who has maintained the spontaneous memorial since it was created by other area residents soon after the Sept. 11 terrorist attacks, said she was shocked by the destruction.

"They trashed 87 flags, ripped 11 memorial tiles made by myself and my children out of the ground and glued the Bob Dylan song to a sign that said, 'America, land of the brave, home of the free,' ' she said.

The Bob Dylan song she referred to is "With God on Our Side,' an antiwar anthem of the 1960s.

"It's unbelievable, because there were absolutely no political messages on this fence. It was all about supporting our troops, which could mean bringing them home, and about remembering 9-11.'

Les Howard, a sociology professor at Whittier College, said the incident might be an indication of some confusion among people trying to stop a possible war against Iraq but uncertain how to express their sentiments. However, he said he does not condone the destruction of symbols important to those who erect them.

"Some think (the best way to support the troops) is to not question their role. Some think the best way is to pursue all means possible to avoid putting them in danger,' he said. "That still does not excuse any desecration of people's symbolic participation.'

Chandler said she plans to rebuild the Sept. 11 memorial.

"We are going to rebuild this memorial, and it will be brighter, bigger and better than ever,' Chandler said.

Debbie Pfeiffer Trunnell can be reached at (562) 698-0955, Ext. 3028, or by e- mail at debbie.pfeiffer@sgvn.com .

[SuperScout]

What did you expect from people who have no moral compass, who practice situational ethics like a art form, who despise their country almost as they hate the President, and are too stupid to think for themselves? Hopefully, the local police will understand the very simple distinction between destruction of private property and vandalism. It truly isn't rocket science.

[9th Inf. Doc.]

After haveing it rather forcefully brought to my attention during the Viet Nam era, I was aware that some pacifists hate,and strive to dishonor,soldiers liveing and dead.Never knew they also hated dead civilians.Guess they'll be going after German shepards and Siamese cats next.

If anybody truly deserves to be tried under "hate crime" statutes these folks surely do.

[VIETNAM 1968]

I will try to make this entry as short as possible. I agree completely with Jeff Collison, the owner of the property invaded by the protesters.

The exercise of Free Speech should end at the border of Private Property. An owner of ANY PRIVATE PROPERTY still has the ability to decide who HE DOES AND DOES NOT WANT ON HIS PROPERTY. If the protesters entered Mr. Collison's private property in order to trash the memorial, they should have been charged with Trespass and Willful Vandalism to Personal Property by the Police, who witnessed the appalling event.

As far as I know, NO ONE has the RIGHT to ENTER and THEN DESTROY PROPERTY BELONGING TO ANOTHER PERSON, IF THAT PROPERTY IS LOCATED ON PRIVATE LAND in which THE PUBLIC DOES NOT HAVE READY ACCESS. Even if the property is a Business, in which the public is invited on the Private Land in order for the owner to conduct business, THE INVITATION EXISTS ONLY TO CONDUCT ROUTINE BUSINESS OF THE COMPANY, not TO ENTER THAT PROPERTY TO DESTROY OTHER PRIVATE PROPERTY.

If the destruction occurred on PUBLIC PROPERTY, in which anyone had access, such as Public Land or a Sidewalk, I believe the Police were correct in stating that the protesters were merely expressing their own beliefs, regardless of how unpopular those beliefs were.

To all my Vietnam Veteran Brothers and Sisters, I want to state:

WELCOME HOME:

Vietnam 1968

[Packo]

Maybe I'm a little slow on the uptake but if they were tearing up flags and destroying the monument, how can it not be malicious intent. Guess we need Officer Andy to help us on this one. Just wish I would have been around when it happened. Hope the owner files charges against these criminals. I second what everybody else has said and feel it's just another sad day in America and a normal day in California.

Packo

[Seascamp]

Let?s complicate the question to Officer Andy a bit. What if the property owner got a bit angry and smacked a vandal-perp and then booted his ass off the property. The ?what if? question is who gets busted. I don?t know didly about California Law but my take is that the property owner gets hooked up and is liable for criminal and/or civil prosecution and the vandal-perp jumps slick and will probably be encouraged to seek damages.

Now then, should the same thing occur just across the California-Nevada border everything reverses and the vandal-perp would be in the slam and maybe getting some lumps and bumps attended to, maybe. We tend to be more primitive and less sophisticated about such things, but oh well; civilization seems to have passed us by.

Scamp

[Andy]

There is an old truism in the law. No victim, no crime. This is particularly true in so called property crimes. If those cops were worth their salt they would have taken down the ID's of the people involved in the destruction of the "monument". Don't know if I have this wrong but I thought it was a number of items hanging from a fence next to a public sidewalk. If's that's true, touching the fence, not damaging it, not sure that's trespass without prior notice and I doubt these people received prior notice not to touch the fence. If the fence was damaged, different story, the protesters can be required to pay for the damage X3, plus court fines, and even jail. If the real victims, the owners of the flags and whatever, wish to file a complain that's fine. It is malicious destruction of private property.
I wouldn't put down the cops too much. The protesters could have been friends of the owner of the fence and were asked to "take down" the memorial. Or as is often the case the owner might not have given a damn. Were that the case the cops might now be looking at law suits if they made an arrest. You do have to remember that symbolic free speech can take the form of protesters burning American flags, giving cops the finger and saying (not shouting which might be disturbing the peace) that the cop is mother f**k** and his wife is a (fill in the blank). Cops put up with that sort of thing (especially in college towns more often than I like to remember).
This ripping down of the 9/11 monument is disgusting. It would be nice if the names and addresses of the protesters were published (freedom of the press) so that people could visit them and "protest" at their homes. Not that I would advocate violence of course.

Stay healthy,
Andy
PS: "...the land of the free and the home of the weird."

[ArtySgt]

you covered this well, touched all the base's that needed doing.
It's some times difficult for people not in Law Enforcement to under stand how much is involved in what appears to be a simple case.

[SuperScout]

From what little I've read of the situation, the items destroyed were on private property, thereby eliminating the "freedom of expression" bromide that some would offer. This being the case, I would fault the law enforcement folks for their nonfeasance. Like seascamp said, these lower life forms are fortunate that they chose to do their evil on the Left Coast, as this sort of behavior is frowned on here in the Hill Country of Texas, to the point riling up some crusty ol' veterans. Woe be onto them.

[39mto39g]

We don't get a lot of protestors here in Texas. There was one a couple weeks back, About 25-50 war protestors showed up and spontaniously about 20,000 Military suporters surrounded them.

I guess it's like I always say. I will fight for your right to burn our flag, BUUUUUT then one of us is going to Jail and the other is going to the hospital.

If people are so anti-American why then are they hear.
There are Planes, Trains, Busses, Trucks, and cars leaving this country every day, Just get on one of them.

Ron