The Patriot Files Forums  

Go Back   The Patriot Files Forums > General > General Posts

Post New Thread  Reply
 
Thread Tools Display Modes
  #1  
Old 04-06-2004, 06:57 AM
Margaret Diann Margaret Diann is offline
Senior Member
 

Join Date: Jan 2004
Location: Valdez, ALASKA 99686
Posts: 505
Default CFS and CFID - same as Gulf War syndrome?

In taking a closer look at the definitions of Chronic Fatigue Syndrome and Chronic Fatigue Immune Defficiency it occurs to me that these are the same definitions as one might give for 'Gulf War Syndrome' symptoms ... which I believe have been a plague on the USA for many, many years.

In short, if the doc doesn't know the cause of the 'persisting, debilitating' fatigue, & you have some other symptoms, too, like Central Nervous system memory loss, and joint pain, etc ... then the doc can diagnose CFS. Interesting ... more background
Quote:
Chronic fatigue syndrome (CFS) was first defined in 1988 by the U.S. Centers for Disease Control and Prevention (CDC)1 as an illness of at least six months duration which begins suddenly with flu-like symptoms, causes a minimum of 50% reduction in activity, and cannot be explained by alternate medical or psychiatric diagnoses.

Since that time, research has tried to solve the mysteries surrounding CFS ? such as its causes and prevalence. There is a long way to go ? there is still no laboratory marker or universal treatment for CFS, but progress is being made.

Diagnosis: In 1994, the CDC revised its CFS case definition.2 Because no simple laboratory test can identify CFS, a physician must exclude other possible causes of the symptoms before diagnosing a patient with CFS.

To meet the definition for CFS, a person must have clinically evaluated, unexplained persistent or relapsing chronic fatigue that is of new or definite onset (i.e., not lifelong), is not the result of ongoing exertion, is not substantially alleviated by rest and results in substantial reduction in previous levels of occupational, educational, social or personal activities. In addition, the person must have at least four of the following symptoms: substantial impairment in short-term memory or concentration; sore throat; tender lymph nodes; muscle pain; multi-joint pain without swelling or redness; headaches of a new type, pattern, or severity; unrefreshing sleep; and post-exertional malaise lasting more than 24 hours. Source
Interesting. They can't figure out the cause of Gulf War Syndrome (Illness), either, can they?

More comments - Gulf War Vet Discussion Forum

An overlooked cause of fatigue:

The current definition seems to fit the symptoms Gulf War vets have ...
and a chemical they were exposed to which causes all of their symptoms, best I can tell is 2-butoxyethanol also known as ethylene glycol monobutyl ether

Because the bone marrow compensates for the loss of mature red blood cells ... the CBCs don't seem out of line and most physicians don't check further. The compensating hemolytic anemia can more likely be found out by a retic ratio.

Do doctors check this when ruling out other causes of fatigue?

Low functioning red blood cells that are smaller in size, and irregular shape, may help to show that what we are dealing with is often chemical exposure to pesticides.

This particular solvent/pesticide/poison is in many, many products, and our people are not adequately warned of the harm they cause.


Sincerely,
Margaret Hursh
PO Box 233
Valdez, AK 99686
valdez@alaska.com
1-888-853-5333

Gulf War Syndrome may still be going on in the military today, too

Thoughts
__________________
Look into BUTYL for CFIDS, CFS, FM & 'Military Syndromes' *

An e-mail request to the CDC

on Flu Symptoms

Traces of blood in urine? *

Diarrhea then Constipation?

Seizures Fainting Dizziness *


sendpm.gif Reply With Quote
Sponsored Links
  #2  
Old 04-06-2004, 07:08 AM
Dragon Lady Dragon Lady is offline
Senior Member
 

Join Date: Apr 2003
Posts: 900
Default

What is your personal obsession with this chemical?

Quote:
and a chemical they were exposed to which causes all of their symptoms, best I can tell is 2-butoxyethanol also known as ethylene glycol monobutyl ether
It seems to me that you are on a personal crusade and I have to wonder why? What is the history here?

DL
__________________
DL
?Whatever else history may say about me when I?m gone, I hope it will record that I appealed to your best hopes, not your worst fears; to your confidence rather than your doubts. My dream is that you will travel the road ahead with liberty?s lamp guiding your steps and opportunity?s arm steadying your way.?
President Ronald Reagan
sendpm.gif Reply With Quote
  #3  
Old 04-06-2004, 07:24 AM
Margaret Diann Margaret Diann is offline
Senior Member
 

Join Date: Jan 2004
Location: Valdez, ALASKA 99686
Posts: 505
Default Thank you for asking

I am.

Because what I thought was a simple check on the chemical of harm to the workers of the Exxon Valdez oil spill cleanup ... turned into a much larger problem: even my friend in IL who is just a homemaker using Lysol Tub 'n Tile has come down with a low red blood cell anemia, joint pain, high blood pressure, high blood sugar ... (endocrine disruption) ... & it turns out that the Lysol Tub 'n Tile she cleaned with regularly these past 30 years has it's own registration number with EPA for containing a pesticide: 2-(2-butoxyethanol) or diethylene glycol monobutyl ether.

I share on this because it is getting away with a lot of harm ... not the least of which should be a 'recurrence' of gulf war syndrome among our present troops.

I briefly went to healthboards.com & found many, many people who didn't recognize what they had was exposure to too much of a chemical.

I'm saying that our doctors need to study chemicals much as a toxicologist would - or every day citizens are 'experimented' on. with this test and that, unrelated to the real villain: chemical overexposure.

I do this as a volunteer. I probably should be doing other things, but I feel that someone of influence may notice this, and do something about it. That is my hope.

And ... many people have a friend or relative who has been affected by this! Who has fallen victim to its poison. However, the secondary symptoms have been studied - not the root of the cause of many cancers: pancreatic, prostate, liver, ovarian; lymphomas and leukemias and brain tumors; even kidney failure and a host of other ailments!
__________________
Look into BUTYL for CFIDS, CFS, FM & 'Military Syndromes' *

An e-mail request to the CDC

on Flu Symptoms

Traces of blood in urine? *

Diarrhea then Constipation?

Seizures Fainting Dizziness *


sendpm.gif Reply With Quote
  #4  
Old 04-06-2004, 09:22 AM
David's Avatar
David David is offline
Administrator
 

Join Date: Aug 2001
Posts: 46,798
Distinctions
Special Projects VOM Staff Contributor 
Default

------------------------------------------------
Diethylene glycol monobutyl ether
------------------------------------------------


Products that contain this ingredient

Brand Category Form Percent

Wagner Premium Brake Fluid Auto products liquid 4-12
Wagner Premium Brake Fluid-11/26/2002 Auto products liquid 10-20
Prestone Heavy Duty Brake Fluid Auto products liquid
Gunk Motor Flush Auto products liquid 4-5
Zep Antibacterial Disinfectant and Cleaner with Lemon Home inside pump spray 5-15
Lysol Disinfectant Basin Tub and Tile Cleaner All Scents (Trigger Spray) Home inside pump spray 6
Lysol Basin Tub & Tile Cleaner Foaming Disinfectant Cleaner Home inside aerosol 5.6
Easy-Off Fume Free Max Oven Cleaner Home inside aerosol 7-11
Mr. Muscle Oven and Grill Cleaner Home inside aerosol 10-15
Zep Stain Resistant Floor Sealer-03/21/2002 Home inside liquid 1-10
Mr. Clean Ultra All Purpose Cleaner Home inside liquid
Dawn Power Dissolver Home inside viscous liquid
Mr. Muscle Oven and Grill Cleaner-Aerosol Home inside aerosol 10-30
Easy Off Heavy Duty Oven Cleaner-Original Home inside aerosol 1-5
Lysol Brand Disinfectant All Purpose Cleaner All Scents (Concentrate) Home inside liquid 0-5
Lysol Disinfectant Direct MultiPurpose Cleaner Home inside pump spray 5.99
Zep Antibacterial Disinfectant and Cleaner with Lemon-04/15/2002 Home inside pump spray 1-10
Tough Act Disinfectant Bathroom Cleaner (liq) Home inside liquid <10
Tilex Spray Soap Scum Remover-09/01/1997 Home inside pump spray <8
Zep Stain Resistant Floor Sealer Home inside liquid <5
Lysol Basin Tub & Tile Cleaner Home inside pump spray 6.0
Easy-Off Fume Free Max Oven Cleaner-05/18/2000 Home inside aerosol 5
Zep Pine Scented Disinfectant and Cleaner-02/25/2002 Home inside pump spray 1-10
Dow Disinfectant Bathroom Cleaner IV with Scrubbing Bubbles Home inside pump spray <10
Zep Pine Scented Disinfectant and Cleaner Home inside pump dispenser 5-15
Lysol Brand Disinfectant All Purpose Cleaner Fresh Scent (Concentrate) Home inside liquid 0-5
Lysol Antibacterial Kitchen Cleaner Home inside pump spray 5.99
Tough Act Disinfectant Bathroom Cleaner (aero) Home inside aerosol <10
Mr. Muscle Oven and Grill Cleaner-03/07/2002 Home inside aerosol 10-30
Spic and Span Heavy Duty Degreaser Home inside liquid
Toilet Duck Thick Liquid Toilet Bowl Cleaner Home inside liquid 1-5
Easy-Off Heavy Duty Oven Cleaner Home inside aerosol 5
Zep Floor Finish for High Traffic Floors-02/25/2002 Home inside liquid 0-10
Dow Disinfectant Bathroom Cleaner III with Scrubbing Bubbles Home inside aerosol <10
Duron Weathershield Exterior Acrylic Semi-Gloss, One Coat White Home maintenance liquid 1.1
Behr Premium Plus Hi-gloss Exterior Acrylic Enamel, No 8050 Ultra Pure Wh Home maintenance liquid 3.24
Glidden Ultra-Hide Aquacrylic Gripper All-Purpose Stain Killer Primer, Whit Home maintenance liquid 1-5
Duron Weathershield Exterior Acrylic Semi-Gloss, White Base Home maintenance liquid 1.1
Minwax Lustre Stain Accent Color & Finish, Ranch Walnut-4240 Home maintenance liquid 2
Duron Signature Select Interior Acrylic Semi-Gloss, Midtone Base Home maintenance liquid <0.6
Behr Premium Plus Interior Hi-Gloss 8600 Accent Base Home maintenance liquid 4
Duron Weathershield Exterior Acrylic Semi-Gloss, Neutral Base Home maintenance liquid 1.1
Duron Weathershield Exterior Acrylic Semi-Gloss, Accent Base Home maintenance liquid 1.1
Minwax Lustre Stain Accent Color & Finish, Mahogany-4220 Home maintenance liquid 2
Duron Signature Select Interior Acrylic Semi-Gloss, White Base Home maintenance liquid <0.6
Thoroshield Home maintenance liquid 2
Americas Finest Premium Interior Acrylic Latex Satin Enamel, Accent Base Home maintenance liquid
Behr Premium Plus Interior Hi-Gloss 8300 Deep Base Home maintenance liquid 3
Duron Weathershield Exterior Acrylic Semi-Gloss, Deep Base Home maintenance liquid 1.1
Minwax Lustre Stain Accent Color & Finish, Briarwood-4250 Home maintenance liquid 2
Fletco Elite Diamond Stain Home maintenance liquid 1
Minwax Lustre Stain Accent Color & Finish, White Oak-4200 Home maintenance liquid 2
Aqua Mix Coating and Sealer Stripper Home maintenance liquid
Duron Weathershield Exterior Acrylic Semi-Gloss, High Hiding White Home maintenance liquid 1.1
Aqua Mix Sealer and Adhesive Remover 1 Home maintenance liquid
Duron Weathershield Exterior Acrylic Semi-Gloss, Midtone Base Home maintenance liquid 1.1
Duron Weathershield Exterior Acrylic Semi-Gloss, Amber White Home maintenance liquid 1.1
Minwax Lustre Stain Accent Color & Finish, Redwood-4230 Home maintenance liquid 2
Duron Signature Select Interior Acrylic Semi-Gloss, One Coat White Home maintenance liquid <0.6
Behr Crystal Clear Gloss Home maintenance liquid 0.14
Behr Premium Plus Interior Hi-Gloss 8500 Pastel Base Home maintenance liquid 3
Duron Weathershield Exterior Acrylic Semi-Gloss, Wheat Home maintenance liquid 1.1
Behr Premium Plus High Gloss Enamel No. 8050 Ultra Pure White Home maintenance liquid 3.24
Minwax Lustre Stain Accent Color & Finish, Golden Pine-4210 Home maintenance liquid
Behr Premium Plus High Gloss Enamel No. 8050 Ultra Pure White-03/11/2002 Home maintenance liquid 4

--------------------------------------------------------------------------

DIETHYLENE GLYCOL MONO-N-BUTYL ETHER
CASRN: 112-34-5


Human Health Effects:



Human Toxicity Excerpts:

SYMPTOMATOLOGY: B. DIETHYLENE GLYCOL ... 1. CENTRAL NERVOUS DEPRESSION ... 2. NO HYPOCALCEMIC TETANY OR METABOLIC ACIDOSIS ... 3. NAUSEA, VOMITING, & SOMETIMES DIARRHEA. 4. ... HEADACHE. LATER ABDOMINAL & LUMBAR PAIN & COSTOVERTEBRAL ANGLE TENDERNESS. 5. TRANSIENT POLYURIA & THEN OLIGURIA, PROGRESSING TO ANURIA. 6. ACUTE RENAL FAILURE ... 7. ... PATHOLOGICAL LESIONS MAY APPEAR IN BRAIN, LUNG, LIVER, MENINGES & HEART. 8. OBSERVATIONS IN ANIMALS SUGGEST REMOTE POSSIBILITY OF PULMONARY EDEMA, INTRAVASCULAR HEMOLYSIS & BONE MARROW DEPRESSION, @ LEAST WITH SOME ETHER DERIV OF ETHYLENE & DIETHYLENE GLYCOLS. /DIETHYLENE GLYCOL & DERIV/
[Gosselin, R.E., R.P. Smith, H.C. Hodge. Clinical Toxicology of Commercial Products. 5th ed. Baltimore: Williams and Wilkins, 1984.,p. III-176]**PEER REVIEWED**


SLIGHTLY MORE TOXIC THAN ETHYL DERIVATIVE (= CARBITOL) BUT OTHERWISE PRESUMABLY LIKE IT. BOTH RESEMBLE ETHYLENE GLYCOL IN TOXICITY & TOXIC ACTIONS.
[Gosselin, R.E., R.P. Smith, H.C. Hodge. Clinical Toxicology of Commercial Products. 5th ed. Baltimore: Williams and Wilkins, 1984.,p. II-181]**PEER REVIEWED**


RESULTS OF LIMITED REPEATED DOSE ORAL WORK REPORTED SUGGESTS THAT MATERIAL MAY BE RATHER TOXIC WHEN INHALED OR ABSORBED THROUGH SKIN IN REPEATED SMALL DOSES.
[Clayton, G. D. and F. E. Clayton (eds.). Patty's Industrial Hygiene and Toxicology: Volume 2A, 2B, 2C: Toxicology. 3rd ed. New York: John Wiley Sons, 1981-1982. 3964]**PEER REVIEWED**


THE ETHERS OF DIETHYLENE GLYCOL ARE LOWER IN TOXICITY THAN THE ETHERS OF ETHYLENE GLYCOL, BUT THEY HAVE MANY SIMILAR CHARACTERISTICS. /DIETHYLENE GLYCOL ETHERS/
[International Labour Office. Encyclopedia of Occupational Health and Safety. Vols. I&II. Geneva, Switzerland: International Labour Office, 1983. 975]**PEER REVIEWED**


... When humans were patch tested with undiluted material, a limited number of the volunteers developed reddening of the skin.
[Clayton, G. D. and F. E. Clayton (eds.). Patty's Industrial Hygiene and Toxicology: Volume 2A, 2B, 2C: Toxicology. 3rd ed. New York: John Wiley Sons, 1981-1982. 3965]**PEER REVIEWED**



Human Toxicity Values:

It has been estimated that the single oral dose /of diethylene glycols/ lethal for humans is approximately 1 ml/kg. /Diethylene glycols/
[Amdur, M.O., J. Doull, C.D. Klaasen (eds). Casarett and Doull's Toxicology. 4th ed. New York, NY: Pergamon Press, 1991. 704]**PEER REVIEWED**



Skin, Eye and Respiratory Irritations:

MODERATELY IRRITATING & INJURIOUS TO EYES, NOT APPRECIABLY IRRITATING TO SKIN ... .
[Clayton, G. D. and F. E. Clayton (eds.). Patty's Industrial Hygiene and Toxicology: Volume 2A, 2B, 2C: Toxicology. 3rd ed. New York: John Wiley Sons, 1981-1982. 3913]**PEER REVIEWED**



Probable Routes of Human Exposure:

The most probable route of human exposure to diethylene glycol mono-n-butyl ether is by inhalation, dermal contact and ingestion. NIOSH (NOES Survey as of 3/28/89) has statistically estimated that 444,917 workers (136,515 of these are female) are potentially exposed to diethylene glycol mono-n-butyl ether in the USA(1). A study initiated in 1983, which surveyed the workplace atmospheres of 336 businesses in Belgium, showed that diethylene glycol mono-n-butyl ether was present in 7 of 67 samples from sites where various materials such as varnishes, sterilization agents and cleaners are employed(3). Non-occupational exposures may occur among populations with contaminated drinking water supplies(2) and from inhalation of household products(4).
[(1) NIOSH; National Occupational Exposure Survey (NOES) (1989) (2) Lucas SV; GC/MS Anal of Org in Drinking Water Concentrates and Advanced Treatment Concentrates Vol 1 USEPA-600/1-84-020A (NTIS PB85-128239) p. 397 (1984) (3) Veulemans H et al; Am Indust Hyg Assoc J 48: 671-7 (1987) (4) USEPA; Compilation and Speciation of National Emissions Factors for Consumer/Commercial Solvent Use. Information Compiled to Support Urban Air Toxics Assessment Studies. US EPA, Off Air Radiat, Off Air Qual Plan Stand, Research Triangle Park, NC. USEPA/450/2-89/008, PB89-207203 (1989)]**PEER REVIEWED**

-------------------------------------------------------------------------------No doubt it is a dangerous chemical when abused. To use it properly you would need good ventilation, a vapor mask, and chemical resistant gloves. Seems to me any chemical you use for 30+ years, no matter how small of a toxicity level it reportedly has, will end up causing you problems. Especially if you don't follow the directions right on the label. All things in moderation huh?
-------------------------------------------------------------------------------
sendpm.gif Reply With Quote
  #5  
Old 04-06-2004, 09:25 AM
Margaret Diann Margaret Diann is offline
Senior Member
 

Join Date: Jan 2004
Location: Valdez, ALASKA 99686
Posts: 505
Default Yes, David, you have hit the nail on the head!

So let's all be very, very careful whenever we use these - most especially those with strong concentrations of poison
__________________
Look into BUTYL for CFIDS, CFS, FM & 'Military Syndromes' *

An e-mail request to the CDC

on Flu Symptoms

Traces of blood in urine? *

Diarrhea then Constipation?

Seizures Fainting Dizziness *


sendpm.gif Reply With Quote
  #6  
Old 04-06-2004, 09:28 AM
David's Avatar
David David is offline
Administrator
 

Join Date: Aug 2001
Posts: 46,798
Distinctions
Special Projects VOM Staff Contributor 
Default

You won't find me using any of this garbage in my house

When I was a child we had green Mr. Yuck stickers on everything under the sink. Mr. Yuck was a huge campaign were I lived back then. Mr. Yuck advised me from using those products in improper manners. The products have not changed except for becoming stronger and more dangerous. A new campaign in this vein would not be ill accepted by the general public if one was able to fund it under the auspices of child safety.
sendpm.gif Reply With Quote
  #7  
Old 04-06-2004, 09:41 AM
Margaret Diann Margaret Diann is offline
Senior Member
 

Join Date: Jan 2004
Location: Valdez, ALASKA 99686
Posts: 505
Thumbs up Right on!

Way to go!

It may surprise you what all contains such.

409 Cleaner?

Maybe Simple Green, too?

Child Safety?

Yes, there is a school board back east that has added policy regarding how school buildings are cleaned. I think they are on the right track
__________________
Look into BUTYL for CFIDS, CFS, FM & 'Military Syndromes' *

An e-mail request to the CDC

on Flu Symptoms

Traces of blood in urine? *

Diarrhea then Constipation?

Seizures Fainting Dizziness *


sendpm.gif Reply With Quote
  #8  
Old 04-06-2004, 09:48 AM
David's Avatar
David David is offline
Administrator
 

Join Date: Aug 2001
Posts: 46,798
Distinctions
Special Projects VOM Staff Contributor 
Default

Here is Mr. Yuck
sendpm.gif Reply With Quote
  #9  
Old 04-06-2004, 01:17 PM
reeb reeb is offline
Senior Member
 

Join Date: Dec 1969
Location: ohio
Posts: 2,127
Default

Well,

I just found out why my MIND is so screwed up !!!!

I have been using these paints for such a long time.

enough.......
__________________
What am I doing here??
sendpm.gif Reply With Quote
  #10  
Old 04-06-2004, 04:11 PM
Hardball Hardball is offline
Senior Member
 

Join Date: Mar 2004
Posts: 165
Default Get over it!!!

Not only was I a painter before and after my service in the military, my mom covered every friggin' piece of wood in our house with Minwax.

My mom used to mix bleach and ammonia together to clean scrub the house.

She also smoked for 60 years, even while I was in the womb. After her second child in the fifties, she was told specifically BY HER DOCTOR to start smoking again to lose weight.

She is eighty now, and just recently stopped smoking and drinking because of a totally unrelated issue.

I used to wash my hands in laquer thinner on a daily basis. I used to be covered with every manner of oil and water based enamels, and urethanes.

THEN I spent years inhaling JP-5 aboard an aircraft carrier. (as noted in the Gulf War forum thread on JP-5) JP-5 poisoning was far outweighed by my fear of being sucked into an intake of a Tomcat, or being blown by jet exhaust into the spinning propellar of an E-2 Hawkeye....(you should watch the video tapes of that actually happening)

The reality is that some people's genetic makeup is just superior to others....and I know that is SERIOUSLY politically incorrect...but its the truth.

I myself am more concerned about some twisted bastard launching some chemical or bio attack in one of our major cities. The recent event in London with the osmium tetroxide terrorist plot has gotten little air-play, but shows how far the terrorists are willing to go to OBEY THEIR COMMANDMENTS to kill infidels.

Most don't think what will happen to our society with just ONE event which totally freaks-out the populace....and it doesn't have to be massive. Just one event which causes massive fear will create a spiraling decline in economic output, and put millions out of work in a matter of weeks.

Get real... if you spend you life bitching about threats from chemicals that MIGHT give you cancer 50 years from now, you had better not walk across the street. Speeding buses or even choking on a veggie-burger can kill you just as easily.

GET OVER IT... God's got your cause of death, and date of death logged into a date-book, and you really don't have a choice in the matter.

Hardball
sendpm.gif Reply With Quote
Reply

Thread Tools
Display Modes

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is On

Similar Threads
Thread Thread Starter Forum Replies Last Post
Gulf War Syndrome: some observations thedrifter Gulf War 3 04-19-2009 05:17 PM
No such thing as Gulf War Syndrome Robert Ryan Gulf War 1 12-13-2007 12:36 AM
Any come down with 'gulf war syndrome?' Margaret Diann Iraqi Freedom 0 05-21-2005 06:47 AM
Why IS there a 'gulf war syndrome?' Margaret Diann General Posts 6 01-31-2005 09:03 PM
Gulf War Syndrome - Everyone needs to help Margaret Diann General Posts 8 01-18-2004 10:52 AM

All times are GMT -7. The time now is 12:54 PM.


Powered by vBulletin, Jelsoft Enterprises Ltd.