"Yeller" Ribbons for their Fat "Yeller" A$$E$!

[BLUEHAWK]

When you were in service, how often did you personally get everything you thought you needed the instant you asked for it?

[Advisor]

Being attached to an advisory team we were told to get our ammunition through Viet channels. Now there was a warm & fuzzy feeling.
Actually, we scrounged most everything...food, ammunition, wire, fuel, water..our ops sgt did that almost full time.

[Gimpy]

Originally posted by BLUEHAWK When you were in service, how often did you personally get everything you thought you needed the instant you asked for it?

Of course not!

BUT..............we DID have the proper body armour and other equipment we needed to get the job done.

We NEVER had to wait for TWO YEARS to get our body armour (of course, ours was much different than those needed today) like todays troops are.

This just adds to the mountains of already accumulated knowledge that this administration DID NOT ADEQUATELY PLAN for this war!

Resulting in the occupation forces being put at unecessary risk and danger along with preventable casualties. Plain & simple!

[BLUEHAWK]

Originally posted by Gimpy

Of course not!

BUT..............we DID have the proper body armour and other equipment we needed to get the job done.

We NEVER had to wait for TWO YEARS to get our body armour (of course, ours was much different than those needed today) like todays troops are.

This just adds to the mountains of already accumulated knowledge that this administration DID NOT ADEQUATELY PLAN for this war!

Resulting in the occupation forces being put at unecessary risk and danger along with preventable casualties. Plain & simple!

Really?

It took me almost 9 months to get issued an arctic Parka!

I think it finally arrived during the summer months, after I had spent a full winter on the flightline filling fuel tanks in sub-zero wind chill while my NCOs were playing Hearts for "paperclips" in Base Ops.

I reckon the Army moves faster than us Zoomies.

Plain & simple.

If somebody went FUBAR on the supply end of things, it was not the CINC. I don't think he checks on those details quite as closely as the Quartermaster is supposed to, eh?

[Gimpy]

[i]Originally posted by BLUEHAWK

I reckon the Army moves faster than us Zoomies.

Yep, I suppose that WAS true back in 67 and 68, can't speak for now though!---Gimp

Plain & simple.

If somebody went FUBAR on the supply end of things, it was not the CINC. I don't think he checks on those details quite as closely as the Quartermaster is supposed to, eh?

I never said it was ALL his fault, did I? It was however under the purview of HIS administration to see the proper supplies and equipment were available in adequate numbers BEFORE hostilities were begun.

They had EIGHTEEN MONTHS from the time the twin towers went down until the war with Iraq began to MAKE SURE body armour and Up-armoured Humvees and other vehicles were ready for deployment.

Not ONLY that...........but the Preznit was made AWARE of these "shortages" shortly after the invasion of Iraq. More than TWO YEARS AGO FOR GODS' SAKE!

What happened to the BUCK STOPS HERE!

He, as Comander in Chief of our Armed Forces has the authority, responsibility and should have the competence, intent, vision and scope of purpose to have these conditions corrected LONG BEFORE any TWO YEAR TIME FRAME has been so carelessly and negligently expired!

There is NO....NADA...ZERO...ABSOLUTELY NOTHING that excuses this reckless, uncaring and obviously incompetent failure by the Preznit and his administration!------Gimp

[BLUEHAWK]

It's all pretty much armchair warrior-in-chief stuff at this point, but I do believe the Prez DID have a Come-to-Jesus encounter with DOD when he first found out about shortages, using words involving the old familiar advice about people needing to pull their head out and get the goods across.


The original war plan, like all war plans, went pretty good okay until a few things unexpected happened. So, we needed more gear, and so far as I am aware, they're getting it at this point. Plus, we here at home are helping out best we can too.

[Gimpy]

Originally posted by BLUEHAWK So, we needed more gear, and so far as I am aware, they're getting it at this point.

That, my dear Sir Blue is just so much BULLSHIT!

If that WERE the case in point.............then WHY pray tell are these sons and daughters being told by their superiors to PURCHASE these items prior to deployment in Iraq........or they'll BE SORRY they didn't??? :cd: :cd:

These are not just isolated instances, these "stories" have been coming out for months and months and months now. All by reputable and verified sources.

I say once again, There is NO....NADA...ZERO...ABSOLUTELY NOTHING that excuses this reckless, uncaring and obviously incompetent failure by the Preznit and his administration!------

[BLUEHAWK]

My understanding is that for the last quite awhile the needed equipment is being poured into theatre... I don't have any knowledge of troops being asked to equip themselves.

[Gimpy]

Originally posted by BLUEHAWK My understanding is that for the last quite awhile the needed equipment is being poured into theatre... I don't have any knowledge of troops being asked to equip themselves .

Well, DUH!.............................I JUST gave it to you with the report from the Marine and his father from Arizona, didn't I? :cd : :cd:

[BLUEHAWK]

Originally posted by Gimpy

Well, DUH!.............................I JUST gave it to you with the report from the Marine and his father from Arizona, didn't I? :cd : :cd:

"...the Marine and his father from Arizona..." does not constitute an epidemic of our people being unequipped, nor does it constitute a massive failure in a war plan.

Lemme put it another way...

Fifty-five some years ago our fighters went into Europe and the Pacific with what they had at the time... no state-of-the-art vests, above-the-ear steel pots (and in the early days only WW I doughboy covers), feebly armored vehicles of every kind, an industrial base that needed to be ramped up, propeller driven aircraft, some good and some not so good (compared with the enemy's) weapons, a supply line longer than God's own beard, a large percentage of our citizens opposed to the war, Congress dragging its feet, outright Communists and Nazi partisans filling American meeting halls with their salutes and diatribes, a military draft, the media sniping at the effort from every side and declaring the total end of democracy, the almost total loss of our Pacific Fleet, and no night-vision goggles.

They whipped butt.

Now, today our forces are adapting to the changing tactics of a brutal and murderous enemy who has been given reason to believe (by our own government's failure to stop them cold 50 years ago, and by the henny-penny's amongst us still today) that all they have to do is keep popping up with their AK-47s out of crowds at the Kirkuk flea market or anonymously detonating roadside IEDs to kill us and they'll be victorious... get their infinite number of virgins, and uphold the name of Allah.

In our times, thankfully, there are measures of protection that can and are being taken. At no time, ever, will it be completely possible to absolutely prevent the death of a warrior in battle.

Our losses, as painful as they are to everyone, are miniscule in number (as a percentage of those deployed or by comparison with WW II, Korea or VN) partially because of techno-protection, and partly because of the skill, valor, determination and grit of our fighters and commanders.

Many of those who endlessly decry the "growing numbers" of our fallen and injured are people who have either never seen or supported armed battle of any kind, or who have another agenda even they perhaps are unaware of. War cannot be fought without losses, injury and destruction... no matter under what circumstances the war began. More than 3,000 people lost their lives on 9/11, not beginning to count the injured.

If a people do not wish to experience human losses, then that people ought to never go to war... as harsh a thing as that is to say. The chances of that happening are beyond being slim... no matter WHO the Commander in Chief is.

What can be done, is being done. Of that I am certain. 100%

I know this with such certainty for this reason, among others:

There is not one way that the American veterans, our officers and commanders, our senior NCOs, or millions of our private people or civilians, would countenance for one day any intentional failure or negligent treatment of our armed forces personnel.

Those days are past, and will never come again.

Lessons well-learned from Vietnam.